A Paranormal State Of Mind
[00:00:00] Jeremiah: Hello, my fellow Terrestrials coming to you from an RV deep in the Carolina Mountains. Welcome to the What If They’re Wrong podcast. The podcast that wants you to question everything, your reality is about to be shattered.
Hello, my fellow Earthlings. Thank you for tuning in. Thank you for listening to the show. Don’t forget to drop a rating or review. Really helps with, uh, growing the show, keeping this good content
So if you could just take a quick second drop a rating, I’d really appreciate it. Also, I’d like to announce that it has been one year since the show started.
We reached the year mark. And I wanna thank everyone listening for tuning in and being a part of these great conversations. Also, I’d like to give a great shout out to some of the guests that have been on the show. Unfortunately, I don’t have time for everyone. Uh, but know that I appreciate you coming
on speaking with
So I wanna give a shout out to Dockside Media. Love having those guys on. Great guys. Eleanor Wagner, the Lady Ghostbuster. Want to thank her Richard Wright for coming on and being part of the show, and also the round table. Chris Sumner for her great work in paranormal investigations, the medium. Claire Voyant, Jess King.
Want to thank her for coming on, Joe from the 2 22 Paranormal Podcast. Want to thank him for being a guest, sharing his knowledge with us. Give a shout out to the lovely group, high Heels and hauntings. Thanks for coming on. Hope to have you on the show. Again, wanna thank Adrian for coming on and sharing her experience, uh, with her abduction.
Definitely hard for her to do, but she was a trooper and got through it. And, uh, lastly, but definitely not least, my guys over there at Pursuit of the Paranormal Great Guys, great podcast. If you haven’t
checked it out,
highly recommend it. And just thank you for everyone, for being a guest. Thank you for coming on the show, being part of this awesome podcast, this awesome journey.
And also, I can’t forget you, the listener. Thank you for tuning in. Thank you for being a part of the show. We made it through one year, hopefully many more to come. Got a lot of great ideas, a lot of great content coming out. We’ll just have fun and remember question everything. Thank you for tuning in to the What If the Wrong Podcast.
I’m joined today by a paranormal State of Mind podcast, and we’re gonna be talking about paranormal topics and, uh, find out about their show and what they, uh, have researched. So I’ll introduce them now. Hello, Michelle and Carro. I hope I said that right. Hi. You said it right. How are
[00:03:08] Michelle: guys? I think we, I’m good.
Uh, I think we lost Kira there, so I’ll just keep going ahead, .
[00:03:16] Jeremiah: Yeah, I’ll let, um, the listener know that we are having storms from the hurricane in Florida, so if connections go out or whatever, we’re just gonna have to live with it. It’s part of Mother Nature. So
[00:03:29] Michelle: Yeah, this part I do my long distance Podcasting sucks sometimes.
[00:03:34] Jeremiah: But I’m sure we’ll get into some good stuff here. So I’ll start with, um, The typical question, what got you guys into the whole paranormal scene and what, um, made you start your podcast?
[00:03:48] Michelle: Okay, so I have always loved paranormal stuff. Um, well, I’m just kidding. I grew up in a very Christian home, so I was not allowed to watch anything paranormal, anything magical, really.
Um, and so growing up I had this fascination with it, but I wasn’t allowed to. And then as I was about 15 or 16, like some weird stuff started happening to me, um, and I told my mom and dad and they were like, ha ha ha, you’re just crazy. Cuz we grew up in the, in our religion being like, if you see something ghostly, it’s because you’re doing something bad.
And so you’re asking for a evil presence. And what I first saw fully. Like my full long thing was like, what I would say an evil president was like a, a shadow in the corner of my room that happened over a series of like weeks, um, to the point where like, I was like squalling and I thought I was losing my mind.
I had a little dog. I brought my dog in there, my dog reacted to it, and I was like, phew, I am not crazy. Um, and so like my husband’s experienced stuff and he’s a complete denial person. Like he can see it and be like, that didn’t happen. I’m like, it. It did though. It did happen. Um, and so through the years, like that’s just been my growth and love of paranormal and Caro is not here.
They have cut out, but it’s completely horrified by paranormal stuff. So, um, we’ve been friends for 10 years or a little over 10 years now, and I wanted to do this and I was like, who’s somebody I know that I wouldn’t get tired of talking to all the time? And that was Cara for me. And I asked them, and they’re like, sure.
So it’s been, uh, it’s been fun though. You know, Cara’s not had any crazy paranormal experiences. They recently moved into a new place and they had a couple, and if they pop back on, hopefully they’ll be able to tell you about it. But, uh, uh, it’s mainly me and then they just get scared. So, ,
[00:05:52] Jeremiah: yeah, I would be the same way.
I’m, I’m mostly a scared person. Like I’ve not, I don’t do ghost investigations or anything like that, but I like hearing about them and I like hearing people’s experiences. Have you done any, like actual ghost
[00:06:07] Michelle: investigations? I did. Um, on our very first episode, I do the Charleston Jail and I talk a lot about the history, but.
My first actual ghost investigation, it was back in 2018, I believe. Um, we had to go to Charleston for a wedding, or no, I’m sorry, it was 2019. But I had to go to Charleston for a wedding and we were like, oh, we just want something to do. My husband was like, Hey, well there’s this old Charleston jail, I think we should do a ghost tour.
And I was like, awesome, let’s do that. Um, so that was my first one and technically my only one. Um, we, I live near Wilmington and there’s just not a lot of like ghost stuff happening here. And when we are out of town, we have our kids, so we don’t really get to, to do anything where we’re outta town like that.
But, um, I, when we’re going through the tour, I had told my husband, I. It feels like there’s something on my ankle. Like it feels like a cat almost rubbing up against your ankle. I looked, there’s nothing there. I happened multiple times at the end of the tour they said, well, we just wanna tell you that sometimes people will feel, uh, there’s a entity of, uh, unfortunately as a, a mentally handicapped person who was gelled there, who they believed that’s there.
And they called him animal. That’s why he comes through. Every time they ask him his name, he says, animal. And they said, he’ll rub against your ankles. And I was like, Ooh, that’s crazy. Um, so that was kind of exciting. I didn’t really make a big deal about it cause I was like, I don’t, people think I’m just like making it up, you know?
Cause that’s my thing. I’ve had, I experienced so much stuff and like, I guess from growing up, I don’t want people to be like, oh, well she’s lying about it. You know? Or cuz I don’t think like I’m a medium or anything like that. I, I’ve seen a lot of stuff. My sister sees a lot of stuff, but, you know, that’s just, I think it’s part of how I grew up not being able to believe in this stuff, you know, per se.
[00:08:01] Jeremiah: just like sensitive, I’ve heard of like, uh, spirit sensitive or mm-hmm. where you don’t really have like the medium gift, but you can still sense certain things. Yeah.
[00:08:12] Michelle: Yeah. I mean I don’t, I don’t know. Um, the thing that I saw in my room, my sister’s 15 years older than me and so she was raised the same way, well as we don’t talk about Ghost.
And then years later I found out through Kiro by accident cause we all worked together at one point that we both experienced and saw the exact same thing in the same spot. Cuz my sister sat down and told me, she was like, guess what? I used to see my room and I stopped telling my story and she was able to tell me like word for word the same thing that I saw.
And then years later when I had my son, um, we had to move back home for a little bit cause I had moved to Charlotte. Was told, no baby for you. And we were like, okay, fine. And then I out there were like, Hey, you’re pregnant. I was like, okay, , I guess this is happening. Um, and so we had to move back to my parents’ house for a little bit after I, my son, I had a brain surgery, so we stayed for a little bit longer and it just, uh, my son was like, I think he was one and a, or he was almost two when we moved out.
And my son was waking up with night terrors and then way later, like a year after we moved outta there, he’s like, I didn’t like that house. I was like, why? He’s like to, it’s the tall black man standing over my baby bed and scared me. And I was like, oh, okay. Like, and he would just sit there and stare me and like, he’s a baby.
You know, he’s not baby, but he’s a toddler at the time. And even now, like, he’ll randomly, he’s four now and he’ll just randomly bring it up. Like, I don’t ever initiate it. So whatever was in. I guess that house just kind of did like a familiar haunting, um, you know, so I guess it’s just a thing that we’ve all seen who’s lived in the house that’s lived in that room anyways.
Cuz it got to the point where my son, where I wouldn’t let him sleep by himself. Especially in that room.
[00:10:07] Jeremiah: Yeah. They, um, I’ve talked with people in the past and on my show mm-hmm. and kids seem to still have a connection to the spirit world and they can sense things. And I talked about how like if, uh, what if the imaginary friends that they have are actually not imaginary
[00:10:26] Michelle: know it’s horrifying. Uh, my kids a little bit weird. He loves the movie Monster House. I don’t know if you’ve ever seen that. Um, so his imaginary friend is a nice monster house, so at least I know. That’s not, and then there’s a subgenre, it’s a bug monster house. So his imaginary friends are definitely different
Um, but at least he’s not like, Hey, there’s a guy sit here, talk with me. That would stress me out. Like, oh my God, it would stress me out so bad.
[00:10:56] Jeremiah: Yeah, that would freak me out too. And mm-hmm. , um, like what would bring a toddler to say that type of thing? Like, it’s just not something that you, a toddler would just make up, I don’t
[00:11:07] Michelle: think.
Mm-hmm. , no. And like, I never bring up ghost stuff around him because like, I already know, like what I see and have seen is a lot. Um, and when he was really little, when we first moved into our house now, he told my husband, he’s like, dare man over there. And was like pointing to the corner and then like, he had this toy farm, the farm automatically went off.
And so like some weird stuff happened with that. Um, and I ended up asking my sister, I was like, she came over one day, I was like, Tell me if anywhere in the house you feel something weird. So she walked through my whole house and she got to my son’s room and she said, that corner feels weird. This is the corner where my son had been talking about.
And um, she’s like, but it doesn’t feel bad. I was like, okay. I didn’t think it felt bad either, so, uh, and I did our whole cleansing thing that like my family members have taught me and just, uh, haven’t really said anything else except for one time I was outta town. My husband was outta town and I was in the room fold and clothes.
And my son was like, Hey, who is that? Was like, what? He’s like, does men in there? I was like, where? He’s like, in the room with you, mom. Who’s this? Men? I was like, get away from me. Go. You horrifying your child. .
[00:12:17] Jeremiah: Yeah. I’ve heard like sometimes you just have to tell the spirit to get like on and get outta here and Yeah.
Um, tell ’em that they’re not welcome there and
[00:12:27] Michelle: mm-hmm. . Well, I see like shadows all the time, um, outta the corner of my eye, but it doesn’t feel like a bad presence. And then one story I’ve never told on our podcast is, you know, the Oculus, like little headset, like the game set. Yeah. So we have one and I was doing boxing on it.
Um, I’ve done it multiple times and you know, when you go to set the boundary, you’ll see like dots. If there’s somebody around you like showing you like, Hey, there’s, well, I was, had it on and I was in the middle of the game and it just was like, it did the thing where it shut itself down so you could see around you.
And it was saying, there’s people standing around me. And I was like, oh my God was there. Nobody was there. It’s just me. My dog was asleep. I didn’t have a cat at the time. Um, so I texted my friend Ian, who gave it to us, and I was like, Hey, this happened. Is this normal? And he’s like, no. And it was actually his, he gave it to us and he’s like, that’s never happened to me before.
And I was like, cool, cool, cool. I’m gonna ignore it and pretend like it’s like something , you know, normal.
[00:13:29] Jeremiah: Yeah, I’ve used that Oculus headset and it’s pretty wild. Like you, it kind of makes you feel like you’re like transported it into another world and mm-hmm. , uh, I think I played well. I didn’t really know how to like navigate it too.
Well someone let me borrow just a headset. I didn’t have any instructions or anything, so mm-hmm. , but I played some like dinosaur one where you’re like trying to get away from dinosaurs or something. Yeah, it was really cool. ,
[00:13:52] Michelle: I can’t play the ones that you move a lot, um, where it’s just like very interactive.
It makes me like sick to my stomach. But like I can do the boxing one, I can do the cyber beats thing. It’s like two workout ones. I can do those. Um, And it sounds like I’m gonna shape guys. I’m not. can try. But, um, my husband had downloaded like a ghost hunting one and it made me like so nauseous because you’re like moving around the room and you got a flashlight, so I can’t play it.
Um, I get, I get migraines real easily too, so that’s probably doesn’t help as much. So,
[00:14:29] Jeremiah: yeah. So I was talking, or I was a guest on a podcast earlier and we were talking about simulation theory mm-hmm. and how we’re all just in a simulation or whatever.
[00:14:39] Michelle: Oh. It’s a
[00:14:39] Jeremiah: disturbing thought. And that Oculus thing just makes me think about that.
Like, if we can make headsets that, and we’re just in the beginning stages of this, like technology, uh, imagine what it will be like in like a hundred years.
[00:14:55] Michelle: I, I can’t, like, honestly, I do it to the point sometimes I’m like, I just wish we could destroy all of. Destroy everything but gps cuz I rely highly on my gps, but everything else get rid of it.
Um, I’ve been hearing that there’s gonna be resurgent to where like the next generation is gonna kind of like hate technology and hate social media. I’m like, yeah, you go do that. . I hope to God it’s my son’s generation. I’ll be so freaking proud of him. He’s four so I’m rooting for it. .
[00:15:26] Jeremiah: Yeah. I mean it is convenient in a way, but then like most of it’s like bad cuz you always have a lot of fighting going on, on social media.
A lot of, uh, people putting other people down. Mm-hmm. , a lot of like depression is caused by Oh yeah. Social media. Mm-hmm. and. It would be nice to like kind of get rid of it in a sense.
[00:15:50] Michelle: Yeah. I’ve never, so when MySpace was a thing, I was like a total MySpace kid because I was a teenager at that point, or a young teenager, um, at Facebook I never cared much about.
And then Instagram, I honestly didn’t get Instagram until I think like 2014 or 15. That’s just cuz I got married and like all my family wanted to see our wedding pictures, they didn’t get to make it. Then even then I was never huge on it and until we got the podcast, it’s whenever I had to get more active on it.
But I really limit my time on it. Like I’ll get on for like a few minutes here and there throughout the day, but I won’t do like the doom scroll and TikTok. I cannot control myself on there. I get so into conspiracy theories that it’s like a depression downhill slope for me and I can’t do it. So like they could, like there’s one point where I was like, maybe the earth is flat.
Maybe they’ve convinced me. And I was like, what the, do you mind if I cuss? No. Okay. I was like, what the fuck are you doing, Michelle? The earth is obviously not flat. This is like damaging your brain. So I will post something on TikTok. I’ll do like a couple of scrolls and I’ll only allow myself like 10 or 15 minutes and that’s it because it destroys my brain.
I’m like, I have so many things I should be doing or could be doing instead of.
[00:17:04] Jeremiah: Oh yeah, I’m the same way. Like I only got TikTok because of the podcast. Mm-hmm. . I was like, I’m only gonna use it for the podcast. Then I got sucked into scrolling one day and I’m just like, half an hour or an hour later or whatever, I’m like, what am I doing?
And a lot of the videos on there are like waste of time. Like, oh, thats literal oh’s. Mm-hmm. . Or like, they’ll start a story and you gotta watch like five parts to find out the end. And then sometimes you get to the end and you’re like, why did I just waste my time on this? Oh,
[00:17:34] Michelle: it’s depressing. I got to the point where I was watching somebody rewatch, uh, wife swap episodes and I’m like, Jesus Christ, what the fuck is happening to my brain right now?
It is literally melting. And this comes from a girl. I’m not a big, uh, I’m not big into reality shows except for when I was a teenager. I loved me some rock of love and flavor love. That was my shit. I remember this. I loved it. . And that’s about it. And I liked, um, face Off, which was like a sci-fi show where they did like, Uh, movie makeup quality, LA stuff like that.
Um, I’m not huge into like the drama, the real world or anything like that, but Flavor of Love and Rock Love had me, I was like, whoa, this is great. But also, I was a stupid kid, so
[00:18:17] Jeremiah: yeah. A friend of mine got me into, uh, that 90 day fiance show and like I was like, why did you do this to me? Now I’m like hooked on it and I gotta see all the stuff and I’m, I get to the end and I’m like, why did I just watch that?
It’s a such a dumb thing.
[00:18:36] Michelle: I came to my boy, well, no, my now husband, but my boyfriend’s house all the time. And I was like, what are you watching? He was just watching Bad Girls Club and I was like, what is happening? He’s like, there is nothing on tv. And we sat down and watched, I would say like a solid five hours of the Bad Girls Club and I was like, and it is burned.
I can remember so much of that season that we watch, it’s just locked into my memory. . Like, it is insane. I was like, this is so sad that we did this. .
[00:19:04] Jeremiah: It is. It’s crazy. So we were, yeah, talking about simulation theory and stuff like that and our thoughts on it, and the Oculus just made me think about it and how it’s totally possible if, oh yeah.
You get into virtual reality, like it’s hard to tell like where you’re at. Like, I’ve seen people like hurt themselves or others doing the headset thing. Mm-hmm. because they just lose, uh, thought of where they’re at. . Oh
[00:19:33] Michelle: yeah. My, um, sorry about that. My husband’s aunt was playing it, and I think she was playing like a rollercoaster game and she was like falling backwards actively, and they were trying to catch her and she was like, stop pushing me.
And they’re like, we’re trying to stop you from falling . We’re making it to where you don’t fall and bust your ass. . Uh, but yeah, no, it’s wild. And I actually, I didn’t go into it cause I was like, I cannot handle this at this point, but somebody was like, did you see in the government paper that they put this is that this is a possibility of simulation?
I was like, Nope, I’m not reading that. Fuck that. . My, my brain is not gonna handle this today.
[00:20:10] Jeremiah: But yeah, it’s true. Like you can get sucked on these, uh, conspiracies and these rabbit holes. Mm-hmm. . And, and then like, you, like you said, when I started, like after my near death experience and I started getting into conspiracies and stuff, I went down tons of rabbit holes and I started getting like, depressed and like mm-hmm.
uh, like freaked out and paranoid and stuff. And I was like, I gotta stop .
[00:20:37] Michelle: Mm-hmm. , uh, I did die. I’ve died twice. I died one time for like a number of minutes for sure. And like, Bryce’s, like, was he great? And I was like, I’m gonna be honest with you guys. Nothing happened. It was the most peaceful thing I’ve ever felt.
I was pissed when they woke me up. Like I was just like, why did you wake me up? They were like, you died. And I was like, it was great. It was just a blackness. And I was like kind of aware that I died but not fully. Like I was just like, this is in my head. I was talking to myself, I was like, this is the best I’ve ever felt in my entire life.
And then I got brought out of it and the nurses like pat me on the face and have like the things over my chest about to shock me. I was like, whoa, whoa, whoa. They’re like, you died. I was like, oh my God. That was wonderful. But then I did die another time, but I died from like going into shock and that was horrifying.
So, you know, I don’t know. But that was a a lot because people are like, you died, what did you see? And I was like, I feel like you want me to tell you I saw something great, but like I didn’t , it was fine. Like thankfully I didn’t see hell. Cuz I’m not like, I don’t consider myself like a Christian, but like I grew up as a Christian household, so there’s that whole heaven and hell in there.
And if somebody’s like, that’s not real, but that’s great. But then I’m like, oh man, what if hell is real? That’s horrifying. . You know? So I was like, I didn’t see hell. So that seems like a plus. But after that I feel like I was like really just like, oh man. And like TikTok wasn’t a thing then. Um, and you know, it’s just like, this is wild.
So I started reading up on like near death experiences or death experiences and you know, everybody sees different things, you know, some people have horrifying tales of like what they’ve seen. I was like, I hope that’s a hallucination. Uh, you know, cuz if you just told me like, there’s nothing after this, you just, you’re dying.
That’s it. I’m like, cool. You fine
[00:22:28] Jeremiah: by that. . So the second time you died, did you experience anything or was it nothing? Um,
[00:22:34] Michelle: so I had said earlier I had brain surgery. I was only four months postpartum when I had my brain surgery. I think it was the night after my brain, like the night of my brain surgery.
And like my parents came in, my husband came and talked to me and um, I was in like the icu, um, and there was like gunshot victims who was like rolling through there and it’s like crazy cuz the two gunshot victims are like fighting and yelling and nurses are trying to calm down. My body got so cold and I started shaking.
And I guess it just like so much screaming cuz I mean, these people were on the stretchers trying to fight each other and they couldn’t hear it beeping. Was like trying to ask somebody, I was like, I’m so cold. I’m so cold. And then like again, I woke up and like, but felt my like, I don’t know if it’s just.
I don’t remember anything, but it felt painful, you know what I mean? Like it felt like a pain. So, when I woke up, like they’re all over me and like patting me and trying to wake me up and they have the shockers over my chest again about to shock me and they’re like, oh my God, are you okay? Then I just remember that night that like I was afraid to go to sleep cuz I was like, I don’t, I’m gonna die again.
And it wasn’t so much like, oh I’m gonna die again cuz I mean I was high outta my mind. But like that, I felt like I felt a pain at that point. So, I don’t know if it’s just like, it was a painful death for me versus other time I just kind of like fell asleep and died. Don’t know what it was, but it scared me to my core to where I was like, oh, this feels horrible this time.
So I don’t know, cuz I haven’t become worse of a person. who know.
[00:24:09] Jeremiah: Yeah, when I had my near death, I had that feeling of being in like blackness. Mm-hmm. . But I saw that like light at the end of the tunnel like everyone says. And um, but that feeling of like peace and love and mm-hmm. and warmth and stuff was intense.
[00:24:28] Michelle: yeah. It was great. It was like, this is wonderful. Give me whatever they’re selling
[00:24:32] Jeremiah: damn for it. And then like you said, you come back and you’re like, dang it, that feeling’s gone.
[00:24:38] Michelle: Oh, it was, I mean, euphoric honestly, truly, um, I’ve never been like a drug person, like a sport pot. Obviously most people have, but it’s never hit, never done anything that great
Now I can’t smoke pots in my brain surgery, you know, and I get all freaked out by it and stuff, but, you know, I was never a pot smoker. I did it like a handful of times, but I was like, oh, okay, this is what the hype was. It’s not that great . Um, so I couldn’t imagine what it’d be like to. If people who have done drugs and they’re like, oh, it’s euphoric.
I’m like, I don’t know. Death felt really euphoric to be honest with you, . Except for that second time. That was horrifying.
[00:25:19] Jeremiah: Yeah. And I’ve interviewed people who’ve had near deaths that weren’t so good and, um mm-hmm. , they had hellish experiences and mm-hmm. , uh, it’s something I don’t want to experience. No, no.
And I wonder if we like, make our own heaven and hell like mm-hmm. . Um, I know it’s a theory that like we kind of decide what we’re gonna be when we pass over. Mm-hmm. . So like, if you are constantly believing in hell and that you’re gonna go to hell and stuff like that, you’ll create a hell when you pass over.
Yeah. Yeah. But if you’re like really positive and like happy and stuff like that, you’ll . I don’t know. It’s just, Thing I’ve heard.
[00:26:03] Michelle: That’s a cool theory. I mean, I hope that’s the case. I mean, cuz in my head I’m like, I’m not a bad person, but I’m not a great person. I’ve done nice things, I’ve done not nice things, but I haven’t killed anybody.
I haven’t stolen anything. You know, I’ve tried to be a good person, so I feel like I wouldn’t go to hell, but, you know, but I was raised Southern Baptist, so this apartments like, damn, I’m definitely gonna go to hell.
[00:26:28] Jeremiah: Yeah. And that’s, that’s a shame and that’s a thing that I talk with my wife about because she’s really like Christian and everything and I just don’t really like how it’s like anything that’s unexplained is automatically the devil or demons.
Mm-hmm. . And um, like you were saying with ghosts, if you saw a ghost it’s cuz you were bad or doing bad. Mm-hmm. . Well that’s not necessarily the, necessarily the case.
[00:26:58] Michelle: No, I mean, um, you know, I think my mom really thought that for a long time. And after my grandma passed, you know, my grandpa is a complete skeptic, but he said that my grandma, like he was wide away.
He said he saw my grandma. She was young cause my grandma had Alzheimer’s when she passed. And so she was very far gone. Um, but he said she was young and he saw her standing there in front of him and said, I’m okay. I’m happy now. And that was a belief for him. And then she, my mom said that she was like laying there.
She wasn’t asleep, she was just laying there and she felt a kiss on her cheek and nobody was at the house. And she smelt my grandma’s perfume, but not I, it wasn’t really perfume as lotion. She always wore it and it was like a very distinct smell. So I think that was like a little bit of belief for my mom.
And so I think she’s a little bit more understanding. But, um, my dad is definitely, he thinks I’m wackadoo for believing in this stuff, you know? Um, and then I have some family members that believe that like, even like stuff like. Oh, if you have multiple personalities, then that’s a possession, you know? And I’m like, that’s crazy.
crazy. I was talking to an uncle of mine, I was telling him about this book and reading. It’s about this woman, it’s supposed to be based off a true story who has like 90 different personalities. And uh, he’s like, oh, well that’s a case of possession. I was like, uh, probably not. You know, it’s just this woman who’s unfortunately very sick, you know?
But it’s wild because like me and my sister believe, uh, one of my brothers does not believe, and my other brother kind of believes, I’m not very close to him. So I don’t go into it too much. But he kind of believes, from what I can tell. Uh, but nobody else in my family really believes except for me and my sister.
So, you know, it’s uh, very lonely whenever it comes to that stuff, you know? So, cuz I mean, we look like the crazy people. , she is crazy to be fair. ,
[00:28:50] Jeremiah: but yeah. At least you have your friend. And, um mm-hmm. , you guys can talk about that stuff and Oh
[00:28:56] Michelle: yeah. Well, like my husband, he believes, but he doubts himself a lot.
And, um, all our friends, like, actually most of the people who listening to my podcast, I think are my friends, you know? Um, and they kind of believe and they’ll be like, oh, guess what happened to me? They’ll go through this stuff, you know? It’s really cool to have that. We all worked at like a movie theater one time, and like all of us through the years were like, this place is haunted, but we never talked about it.
And then like one day they’re like, I told a story about it on the podcast. They’re like, oh shit. That’s so crazy. Cuz the same thing happened to me. I was like, yeah, it’s pretty much happened to everybody, like through the years. So .
[00:29:34] Jeremiah: Yeah. And we were talking about on my, um, I forget where I was talking or who I was talking to, but we were talking about how you have these legends, urban legends from mm-hmm.
like everyone has ’em from all over the world. Mm-hmm. and, uh, It’s just a crazy thing that you’ll have all these tales and I kind of find it hard to believe that it’s all just make made up, make believe cuz right, if so many people are experiencing it, uh, there’s gotta be something there.
[00:30:05] Michelle: Well, it’s just like with sleep paralysis.
I mean, so many people in different countries, at different times in the world have experienced so many of the same things. You can’t tell me that they’re experiencing a scientific thing per se. How is it not gonna be a sleep demonn or, or even like a shadow man or the hat man. I mean, even before the internet, there is people, you’re like, Hey, I’ve been seeing this thing and it has somehow, almost eerily all the same.
So you just can’t convince me that this is not real and this is not happening. I mean, I think there are people who lie, don’t get me wrong. Uh, ghost shows. I’m like, eh, I’ve watched ’em cuz they’re entertaining. But I’m like, I feel like most of the time you’re lying. Um, but. Yeah. I mean, you just can’t convince me that all that stuff has a scientific reasoning behind it.
Cause I don’t believe it, you know? And I think the world would be so boring if we decided there has to be a scientific reason behind literally everything that happens, you know? So, I
[00:31:02] Jeremiah: mean, yeah, definitely. And, uh, the sleep paralysis, like you said, I’ve been kind of looking into it and I’m kind of wanting to get someone that’s like an expert on it to come all over.
That’d be awesome. Mm-hmm. . Um, but there’s a common thing that I hear is like the, uh, old hag or something. Mm-hmm. , a lot of people see this like nasty looking woman, , demonic looking woman. I guess I never, for
[00:31:29] Michelle: lack of a better term, I never had sleep paralysis. Um, but my sister. I have a theory and I think sometimes when you’re depressed you can be more open to seeing ghost stuff.
And so when I see the most stuff, it’s usually when I’m gonna die for depression. Um, my sister poor thing, she just constantly suffers with depression and when she’s really low, so many things happen to her and it’s just unbelievable. But she came over and was like, Hey, can you come over and like cleanse my house?
I was like, sure, whatever. Um, so come and cleanse your house and it’s another time my husband’s outta town. It sounds like he’s outta town all the time. He’s not . Um, it just happens. A lot of weird stuff happens when he’s out of town. I think it’s cuz I’m already stressed out anyways. And so I had the baby monitor right here and it’s like a video baby monitor and I’m like half asleep and like my son’s stirring and so I go to check him out and there is.
We call them, like I always grew up calling Booh Hacks. Um, there’s like a, what I grew up calling a Booh hack standing there and crouching my bed. And it’s like, she’s really like, I don’t know, almost like Gomes looking like stringy hair and just like crouched over and like rocking back and forth on like their, her like it’s heel and like staring at me.
And I was like, oh fuck. Oh man, what did my sister do? So, my son’s kind of staring and like he’s crying and I’m like, ah. If it happened for Ave on time before I was like, I gotta turn over. Once I turned over I could still feel like the pressure on the bed and like, I made sure my son was okay.
Like he just has like random night tears sometimes. And I was like, I can make the decision to roll back over or I can just keep my back turned. And I don’t know how long it was, it could have probably only been like 20 minutes, but it felt like at least three hours that like, it was just rocking back and forth.
next, and I could feel the pressure, the rocking back and forth, and I could feel like that. I don’t know if you’ve ever experienced anything like spiritual or anything like that, but like there’s a, a not scary feeling. There’s a very scary feeling. And like my heart was racing and I was like, oh, this is bad.
This is really, really bad. And then I finally was like, Hey. I’m sorry. Please leave. Like, I don’t want you here. I will never cleanse my sister’s house again. Like I said her name, I was like, you can go away now. And uh, I never saw it again. Months later, my sister has her security camera on and she has like part of in her house and there is a face in there.
And at first it was like, it looks like a skull. And I was looking and I was like, oh no, that is a hag face. That was exactly what that was. And I was like, that’s the same shit that I saw Brock, I, excuse me, back and forth on my bed. And she’s like, are you serious? She’s like, come close my house. I was like, no, I will not.
I don’t even go. Won’t even, for the most part, I won’t go to her house anymore cuz it’s so active and it feels so oppressive in there. Can’t do it.
[00:34:33] Jeremiah: Do you think it’s from her depression? They kind of like I do. Yeah. Attached
[00:34:38] Michelle: to that. I do. Um, and she worked at a, well, a drug in like alcohol rehabilitation center.
So like they’d come in as people who are trying to wean off of drugs and like, you know, they, they give them medicine to replace it and, um, it’s a small branch and so she was the only office worker there and she was telling me about how like, oppressive it feels and like if other women from the other office would come down there, like they would get so scared.
And so, um, it was very active there. And I, I mean that’s a depressive, depressing place. I mean, there’s no doubt about it. When I was in the hospital, I could feel so much heaviness in the icu, not just like, even when nothing bad was happening, I could feel like heavy even before my surgery. Cause I’d have like a couple small procedures done.
Um, I wasn’t on any medicine and you could just feel these waves of late depression and sadness and stuff come through you. So I definitely think that, I don’t think you have to always be depressed to feel it, but I definitely think that when something attaches to you like that, it can be because you’re in a dark spot.
And my sister, she’s not a bad person, but she suffers with depression a lot and she has trouble fighting it. And whenever I am in a bad spot, that’s when I can feel things kind of like creep in on me.
[00:35:58] Jeremiah: Yeah. I can definitely see that happening. And I think, um, and I’ve talked with mediums and stuff like that, and definitely attachment seems to be a real thing and mm-hmm.
that if you let the spirit attach to you, it’ll follow you, like wherever you move or wherever you go.
[00:36:16] Michelle: Yeah. I mean, we’ve had, my husband had an apartment and he’s have cap and um, a. There was so much activity in there and it wasn’t like, it was scary, but it didn’t feel like it was trying to attach attack to you or attached to you.
Um, and then we had his cousin who moved in the same apartments, but it was like a different separate set of buildings. And they had their daughter, it was the one bedroom, so they were all sleeping in the living room or sleeping in the bedroom, and they felt like something was kind of onto them, but they kept letting their daughter take naps in there and at night they would let it sleep.
But it got to the point to where like their daughter as a, like a baby slash toddler was like, no, no, no in there. The point at the corner. That’s where his cousins always felt that. It got to the point so bad to where they wouldn’t sleep or even go in the bedroom. They moved all of their stuff out of the bedroom into their living room because like it felt like every time they’d go to sleep that there was something dark happening.
And honestly, my husband’s bathroom and bedroom and the apartment was like the darkest part. Like you could go in, my cat would go in there. To use litter box and like, you know, when you push a cat and it slides across the floor, it would just be like something that would take it and slam it outta the bathroom and just like, it would slide across the floor and we’re like, what is happening?
Or like, we had a, since your living apartment, we would sleep at earbuds in cause our neighbors would be loud, but you could hear somebody come up to your ear and like whisper and it’s just like little whispers and you have like heavy duty earbuds in. So that was a horrifying place. Um, you know, but I mean, we weren’t really in a bad spot.
It’s just like, it just seemed like, I think there’s just like a lot of like, it’s a bad neighborhood kind of. And uh, I think there’s just like such a bad energy in this set of apartment buildings at the time. They’ve cleaned it up a lot, but I think it’s just like so much energy and I mean, we also don’t know what’s happened in the past on the land or anything like that with stuff like that.
So same thing at my mom and dad’s house. I mean, we didn’t know what happened on the land there, you know, I mean, we live in a. Place where like settlers had started coming and a, you know, it, its a lot actually where I grew up, I was called at the time when settlers called, was called Half Hell. So, cause they felt like they were halfway through hell.
So I don’t know. Oh geez.
[00:38:34] Jeremiah: Yeah. Yeah. I live in a new construction development and, um, even though the houses are new, like you said, the land could still have residuals or still have spirits there. And there’s actually a section that they blocked off that is a, um, old slave graveyard. Mm-hmm. , there’s no like tombstones or anything, but like, I guess they found out when they were like digging for the plots or whatever they found, uh, graves or whatever.
So now they have it like fenced off and you’re not allowed to build there and stuff like that. Yeah. Um, but yeah, and even be. Go
[00:39:14] Michelle: ahead. I’m sorry.
[00:39:15] Jeremiah: No, and then there was a lady, uh, one of the real estate agents here said there was a lady who was dead set on buying the house next to the slave graveyard.
Mm-hmm. . So I don’t know if she was like a medium or something or just wanted to be there. I don’t know. But ,
[00:39:32] Michelle: I don’t know. I mean, I, I always thought it being cool to live beside a graveyard. Cause I honestly think they’re beautiful. Um, but then I was like, uh, I don’t know. Cause like I don’t have a good track record of like, spiritual stuff.
Like I said, I mean, I see stuff around me sometimes and it’s not negative, but, and I have like a little ghost cat that like, hangs out sometimes. But, um, you know, it’s, I don’t know if I could actually do it once it came down to it. Uh, my grandparents, they have a 30 acre farm, and when they actually moved into it, it was just like on boulders.
The house was sitting on boulders. And, uh, they had an outhouse. They didn’t have electric electricity. And this was like in the sixties, I think, until like seven months after they moved in. But on top of the hill there was a bunch of like old wells and stuff that had like fallen in. And there was actually somebody who was buried up there and I think it was like 15 years before the family came back and like dug up his grave and brought him to where their new land was.
Um, but you can still see what I was growing up is cleared up now, but you could still see like part of his like gravestone there. I was like, oh, okay. You know, and he was like in a pine box and like according to my uncles, like they couldn’t find all of his like bones and stuff. So like, I don’t know if that’s true.
You know, , they also made up a, uh, crypted kind of called Ro Reddi and told me about that growing up. So I don’t really know what to believe about that. There was for sure a grave up there. I can tell you that I don’t know if any bones got left behind .
[00:41:07] Jeremiah: Yeah. And there’s been tales about stuff like that. For since the beginning of time.
Like you have the ancient Indians, like the American Indians, , and they have tales about spirits and all that kind of stuff. And then you have other cultures around the world heavy into spirits and stuff like, uh, China, Japan, uh, Indonesia. So like I said before, there’s gotta be something to it. There can’t just be nothing.
[00:41:43] Michelle: No, no. Um, well, evidently we have Native American family members. I don’t know. Um, I know my uncle is Native American by, and he married into our family and he’s. His wife has passed away. So my aunt, grand aunt’s passed away now, but he remembers him sitting me down and just telling me all this stuff about like all their spiritualism.
I was like, that’s beautiful that you guys have all this stuff because I mean, we weren’t allowed to leave in that stuff. And I mean, it’s amazing. And where my grandpa lived there is like arrowheads and uh, spears and stuff. Like as they were like digging through, they would find all this stuff. And actually my grandpa and then were constantly donating it.
And like the local tribe was like, you can just start keeping it. Like, we’re fine. And so like my uncle, he had a collection of about 150 arrowheads and like spearheads and stuff. But my uncle, my other uncle, the Native American one has always told me about all the crazy stuff that like they believe in. I mean, not crazy, like bad, but like crazy, like scary and like, I mean even like the skin walker thing, you know, I mean, Horrifying cuz he didn’t go out on straight call at that.
But like he told us like about that. So even before it’s been this huge thing cuz it’s so popularized now. Remember him sitting down and like telling me like all these things as like a nine year old kid. Oh my God, this is so scary. Got Ro Red eye running around here and then I got these like skin people and it’s horrifying.
[00:43:17] Jeremiah: Yeah. They have a skin walker and of course the Skin Walker Ranch and then mm-hmm. . You have other tales like Chewa Cobra in Mexico. Mm-hmm. and, uh, when Togo. Mm-hmm. . So there’s tales all over the place of like, I don’t know, like crazy creatures. .
[00:43:37] Michelle: Yeah. My husband’s grew, my husband grew up in West Virginia and I swear to God I’m getting him on a podcast one day.
But, um, he. Has seen some of the wildest things in the mountains. Like, uh, either even if it’s just like ritual ritualistic stuff. Like people dressed up in these like crazy, like he described as like Japanese clown outfits and like, but then he was like, the woods would just get silent and he’s like, you could hear somebody like playing in a pipe, which could also be ritualistic thing.
And he was like, and you could hear like these giggling noise and you’d see like running through the woods, like these little people and not like little people, you know, but like tiny little, like, I don’t know, cup size people running through the woods and he’s like, horrifying. You know? So probably bigger than a cup, but very small little creatures.
And he’s like, it’s horrify. And he was talking about like how like they would always sneak out and go past where they’re supposed to do to go and like, They would always be relieved when they get caught, even if they’re gonna get in trouble. Cause like, there’s been a couple times where they would like get out past dark and like it would just get this like weird, crazy silence and like all this weird stuff would start happening.
Um, but he did see a lot of like, I think ritualistic type things. Like, uh, somebody had like trigger warning for animal death, but somebody had like killed a bunch of puppies and put them in jars and they found like all the puppy jars and like, geez. It was just weird. Yeah. I was like, that’s horrifying.
Why would you tell me this ?
[00:45:08] Jeremiah: Yeah. That’s, that’s crazy. And I’m sure there is a lot of stuff out there in the deep woods and the mountains and Oh yeah. There’s even like, um, what do they call ’em? Where group of witches, coven or something? Coves, yeah. Yeah. Where my wife used to live, they had a whole group of witches that would go in the field.
Like, buy our house and do their little like rituals and seas and whatever. Um, yeah. So yeah, it’s definitely, and then on other third world countries and stuff, you have a ton of different mm-hmm. things still going on today, like voodoo Oh yeah. .
[00:45:49] Michelle: Yeah. It’s wild. I mean, uh, even in like Louisiana and stuff, voodoo hudu is all very prevalent, you know?
And, uh, I don’t know much about it. Like, I don’t wanna disrespect anybody, but I, that’s the part where I’m like, oh, I don’t know if I fully believe, but I’m afraid not to believe. Cause I don’t want you to like, curse me. So I believe that you can have like, Um, maybe medium ship powers, but I have trouble with like, oh, I’m making this brew.
I think you can put positive affirmations out into life or negative ones and sometimes that stuff can happen and come true, but I don’t know. So I’m not trying to offend anybody, so please don’t get mad at me. I just have trouble grasping that part of it, you know? So it’s horrifying to think about if somebody does have this power.
I would also not mess with anybody who does like voodoo or hudu, you know, anything like that. So, um,
[00:46:42] Jeremiah: yeah, even if, if I didn’t believe in it, I’m not gonna mess with someone who, who does just in case .
[00:46:48] Michelle: Yeah. Yeah. I wouldn’t mess with anybody anyways, just cuz their belief. I mean, as long as you’re not hurting anybody or anything, I don’t, I don’t give a shit what you do, you go for it.
Um, just don’t hurt anyone. But I remember we were in Louisiana one time and like we were walking past, it was like this famous, uh, I guess it was a food do. Place, I don’t know. But, uh, there’s like these priests who kept walking by and kept doing like the Catholic symbol, you know, or the head the chest thing.
And I was like, I just wanted sit here all day and watch all these Catholic priests walk by and just do their little Catholic symbols just to see how many you walk by and actually do it. Cause I mean, while we were there, we walk by it a couple times. We see like a bunch of priests walk through and I mean, I live in the south, so I mean, we didn’t see, we don’t have a lot of Catholic churches here that I know of.
We have a lot of Baptist churches. Um, but I didn’t ever, I’ve never seen, but like one time when I went to the Catholic church in the full Catholic garb and I was like, whoa, this is wild. . . But they would also try to walk on the other side of the seat street if they could away from that. But they would still do the,
[00:47:52] Jeremiah: oh, so they weren’t doing voodoo.
They were actually. Walking past it, like trying to, they’re
[00:47:57] Michelle: walking past it to Damnit or whatever. Yeah. Yeah. And like if you could watch them cross the street to not walk in front of it. And I was like, well, they’re scared of something. I feel like I should be scared of something too .
[00:48:10] Jeremiah: Yeah, it is crazy. And I’ve seen videos of like their rituals and stuff, and it is really creepy
Like they’re try to bring people back from the dead, like, um, someone who just recently died or whatever, and they’ll do all these other rituals. I don’t even know them all. But yeah, it is, uh, it is intense . Oh,
[00:48:33] Michelle: it’s, it’s pretty scary. I mean, I’ve never seen it firsthand, but I’ve heard of a couple accounts.
I had a, um, A family member distantly who she had passed away by the time I was born, but my mom was kind of close to her and she kind of got involved in some colds and then she got involved in something down there and she had told my mom that she had went to a place where they had temporarily tried to wake somebody up, like they temporarily brought ’em back, but like their soul also, I’m not telling you mean, this woman had at this point kind of lost her mind and it was the sixties, seventies, so I don’t know what she was doing, but she said it was the scariest thing she’d ever seen.
Um, and then her husband said he had sold his soul to the devil, uh, and he got super rich and got a super hot wife after that. So who knows?
[00:49:27] Jeremiah: Yeah, I did. Um, one of my first episodes was satanism and music industry and mm-hmm. . I covered some of that and I still want to do another episode on it cuz there’s still a lot to cover but mm-hmm.
Yeah. It does seem like these artists say they sold their soul and then the next thing they know they’re living at large and getting all this money. Or they’ll say they sold their soul and then they’re able to play guitar really well when before they weren’t really that great at it. And yeah, it’s just, uh, like we said with the spirits and there’s gotta be something else cuz it can’t just be a coincidence or whatever.
I find it hard to believe all these artists talk about this stuff for it not to be like somewhat legit . I
[00:50:13] Michelle: mean, who’s that? I can’t think of his name, but that old blues, I wanna eventually do an episode on him, but the old blues player who like said he went to the crossroads and stuff, oh, it’s also off where Art.
But yeah, I mean they did that kimo and there kind of deal. But you know, I mean that’s a real story. And that guy became famous for back then for what he did. I mean, especially being a black man who couldn’t get famous at all back then, you know? Um, but.
[00:50:42] Jeremiah: It’s a crazy story. He had friends, um mm-hmm. , he had friends and I watched the interviews and stuff and now it’s old cuz it’s a long time ago, but mm-hmm.
Yeah. His friend or his band mate or whoever was saying like, yeah, when we were rehearsing and stuff, he was making all kinds of racket cuz he wasn’t really good at guitar or anything. And then when he came back from the crossroads, he was able to play guitar. Like he was, like, he was able. Play it like no one he’s ever seen before
[00:51:14] Michelle: and Oh yeah, it’s interesting.
I really wanna like do a deep dive onto his life because I mean, regardless if that isn’t true, I mean it’s still crazy concept to be like, hey, like um, I believe I still, and I mean it could be the whole thing where like you can tell yourself this thing, you know, what is it, like the pill you can take and whatever’s, oh the placebo medicine, the placebo effect.
I mean maybe it could be the placebo effect, but even then that’s interesting thought to in itself. You know, I wish I could do that. Like, oh, you’re super, super talented and rich now. And my body’s like, yeah, we are .
[00:51:47] Jeremiah: Yeah, it’s just crazy. Like, and I can go on and on about it cuz I love the topic, but mm-hmm.
Yeah, there’s, I totally believe there’s a lot more going on than we know or have been taught and, um, think there’s something with the spiritual side and I think there’s other dimensions, but that’s just my.
[00:52:10] Michelle: I believe fully. Yeah. I mean, here’s what I’ve always said, and I even say to my parents, it’s obnoxious to think that we are the only things out there and there’s nothing else.
I mean, even like my, I grew up being like, oh, there’s no nothing else on life, other planets. I’m like, that’s bullshit. Like, do I think that we are it? That’s insane to me. You know? Um, you know, and I think that there could be other dimensions that’s crazy. I mean, look at like the galaxies and, I mean, there’s just no, no way you can convince me that there’s not other dimensions.
And you know, I’m not great at science. Like that’s voice the shit outta me. not my favorite topic topic. My husband’s super into like physics and science and stuff. And he’ll sit down and like, Hey, this is really interesting. I’m like, see, they, they’re kind of onto something. Even if they’re scientific about it, they’re onto something, you know, to, to an extent.
You know, that there is of course, life outside of Earth and that there’s a pos a huge possibility of other dimensions, you know?
[00:53:09] Jeremiah: Yeah. It’s uh, crazy that the government has been kind of admitting that there is UFOs
[00:53:15] Michelle: now. . Yeah. Yeah. And it’s just that the whole joke, like how they just like slipped that into 2020 and everybody’s like, I don’t give a shit.
Like honestly, I could care less because of Covid. Yeah, yeah, yeah. I don’t care what’s happening. My life is a dumpster fire. I’ve lost my job. You know? Who cares? Yeah. Take me now. Aliens.
[00:53:34] Jeremiah: Yeah. I was a little, uh, I was like, you gotta think, why did they release it now? Because if there was all that distraction, they’re like, oh, we just slide it out and only the people who are really into it will realize what we’re doing.
[00:53:50] Michelle: Mm-hmm. . Oh yeah, for sure. As soon as I was, I was like, I got you. I’m picking up, picking up what you’re throwing down. Like everybody’s stressed out. We’ll throw out some killer. And then we’ll be like, aliens and they’ll just forget about it. , I was like, yeah. That’s wild
[00:54:03] Jeremiah: to me. Yeah. That Killer Hornet thing.
I’ve never seen one. I don’t know if they’re even
[00:54:08] Michelle: real. It’s fucking happened to ’em. There’s no way they’re real. Like, no way. Like what happened? We got, we’re infested by Killer Hornets, but you’re never gonna see one. Yeah. Like you guys are just like, you know, we’re about to tell them with some serious shit.
We really just wanna like really lower that blow for them. .
[00:54:26] Jeremiah: Yeah. And that’s, uh, that’s a whole nother conspiracy show enough. Oh yeah. But um, yeah, it’s just, there’s so much out there, so much more to life than what we’re taught in school or what they want you to believe. So I like having shows like yours and mine and all the other people who are into paranormal just trying to, you know, make something out of it and research it and, and try to bring to light some of these questions.
[00:54:57] Michelle: Oh yeah. And if I could go out and like ghost tone, I would ghost tone the shit outta everything. I’d be scared the whole time . I wouldn’t do it by myself, but I would, cuz I feel like there’s just, you’ve got to be able to find out so much more. Just, I don’t know, it’s just gotta be such a boring life.
And I grew up this life being like, well there’s God and nothing else. He created the heavens and the earth and then there’s heaven and hell and I don’t know. But if you get it, not to get too religious, but if you get it to the Bible, I started rereading it. It’s wild. Like go back as an adult where you are mentally now and read it.
And that’s all I’ll say. Cause it is a wild ride. Oh yeah.
[00:55:34] Jeremiah: crazy stuff in there. Yeah. .
[00:55:37] Michelle: Yeah. So I won’t go too much in that cause I don’t wanna make it too religious thing. But definitely as an adult, you guys, if you’re not a very religious person, go back, reread the Bible and it is a hoot. It is crazy.
[00:55:51] Jeremiah: Yeah. Cause I think, I think a lot of people have this, uh, notion from like Sunday school and stuff like that. Mm-hmm. , the way they present it and stuff like that. And a lot of people either don’t have the time or don’t take the time to like read through it themselves. Mm-hmm. , so they kind of just go off the main stories like, oh, Noah’s Ark.
Mm-hmm. and uh, whatever, Easter and Christmas and all that. But then there’s so much more stuff in there.
[00:56:22] Michelle: Well, I think like, so we’ve read the book there multiple times as growing up, and I just think there’s just that point to where, and I don’t mean this in a bad way for people, it’s religious. I think there’s that point to where like, you’re just willingly ignoring these wild things and you’re just like, oh, they say this, but they really meant this.
You know, because that’s how you’re raised. So me, Who, who has read the, the bible many, many times, had it read to them and then rereading it as somebody who’s, I would say, more agnostic. Uh, it is crazy to read through. Again, I haven’t done it all the way through. I’ve done it a couple of chapters here and there, or a couple books, but, um, it’s all wild ride guys and it’s so fun.
I mean, even if you’re not trying to be like, and I’m not trying to be a dick, even if you’re just like, oh, I just wanna reread it. Just go through and reread it. Cuz if you are a Christian or whatever, you are a Catholic, read what you’re preaching, you know, it’s, it is. And and then maybe you’ll read something like, ah, that sounds wild.
Cuz most likely that’s what it’s gonna be like, you know? So
[00:57:25] Jeremiah: yeah. And then I’ve talked about, um, with other guests. My wife too is like, they left out a lot of stuff too. There’s mm-hmm. , like the book of eoc, book of mm-hmm. , uh, I forget the other ones, like Joshua or something.
[00:57:41] Michelle: There’s a book, uh, Mary Magdalen evidently wrote a book, I don’t, I think it’s called The Book of Mary.
I could be wrong. So don’t quote me. And I would love to go back and read that because I mean, Mary Magdalene was like, if you don’t remember, was like the bel who was like possessed and stuff like that. So I would love to go back through and read that. Uh, and I mean, honestly, it’s just amazing. I wish I would’ve, like from a age I wish I would’ve gotten to like Greek mythology and stuff.
Cuz as I’ve gotten older, I’m like, God, there’s so many things that I think would be fascinating and amazing to read. And at this point in life with a kid, and I’m going back to work next year and I could do the podcast stuff, I don’t know if I forget to put that much knowledge in. So I wish, as like a young child, I would’ve thought this or and be like, you know what, there’s all these things.
And even religion, every religion I wish I could go through and read every religion. I mean, I studied up on Buddhism and stuff like that, but like I wish I could understand. and not just go through it with like a skeptical eye, but just to understand what they’re thinking, where they’re coming from and their beliefs, because it’s fascinating.
I mean, it’s beautiful in its own sense. As long as they’re not hurting people, it’s a beautiful thing to think of. Um, and I’m truly jealous of people who are religious. I wish I could be, I’m just not, you know? But it’s, it’s a crazy thing. So if there’s any younger people, I don’t think you’d be listening to this, but very, very young people just go and explore and read about everything you possibly can, because even if it’s not like knowledge, like people feel like you should know about, it’s great to know this stuff.
I mean, you’re just gonna become a better and smarter person for it, you know?
[00:59:19] Jeremiah: Oh, yeah, definitely. So what’s, uh, next in your podcast journey? Like what do you, what do you, what do you want? Like, what’s your dream guest or dream topic? To do on your show?
[00:59:34] Michelle: Um, so I really suck at editing. Uh, it stresses me out.
So I guess I don’t have as many on there cuz we just, honestly, it seems like every time we do it, like something just goes wild and wrong. So we use Riverside, which is what we’re recording off last time we did at Riverside, which is like going in and out for everybody the whole time. Um, and I’ve never had that problem really.
And then it just seems so with guests, I would’ve liked to eventually be able to get guests, but have to be the point to where like, if I’m ever making money and have to upgrade on maybe doing Riverside Plus or something like that because like Zoom, I hate Zoom, Skype, I hate Skype. None of that’s ever worked for me.
Um, . And it’s hard because Kara and I don’t live together, but I would love to talk to, uh, an investigation team, investigative team. I don’t have any in mind that’s like really seen some stuff and I feel like it’s truthful. I would love to talk to mediums, uh, who I feel like is truthful. Um, and that’s the thing is like, I’m such a skeptic about people and I don’t mean to sound like a jerk, it’s just, I’m like, uh, I feel like you could lie to me easily.
Uh, but that would be my dream. And as far as the podcast, I don’t think we’re ever gonna get famous. Uh, it’s, it’s really fun to do. Um, and if we got like any, I’ve always said if I’ve ever gotten any money off of it, I think I told you this, if I ever got money off of this, it would be so I could buy, I could hire somebody to edit from it cuz I freaking hate it.
But I don’t think a fame will ever come for us. It’s just honestly something so fun that I get to do with somebody I really care about. And, uh, I’ve said this a couple times, I’m not a good texter. I’m more of a in person or a phone call person. And I feel like this age, and Carol and a couple of my friends are a little bit younger than me, and so they’re big into the texting and I can’t get behind it.
So I feel like through the years I’ve lost touch with my friends. So for this, me and Cara talk to each other, you know, through text a couple times a week, but we talk to each other every week through camera. And I think that’s helped us find a friendship again because, I mean, we weren’t not friends, but we would talk every couple of months, you know, and I’m just not gonna have a heart to heart with somebody through text message.
So this. Range of generations where she’s texting, that’s not good for me. Um, and so I think this just has been an awesome experience and, uh, we’re working on doing more. We kind of went off topic there for Halloween cuz we did so many, like an everyday mini episode thing. But we’re getting back into like, doing the states and stuff and throwing a couple special episodes.
Um, we’re actually gonna do a Simpsons episode eventually, where we just go through like all the crazy things that Simpsons predicted and like that’s come true, you know? Oh, I
[01:02:14] Jeremiah: to hear that
[01:02:14] Michelle: one . It’s, it’s just, I, it is fun for me and I really do enjoy it. You know, I love the research. Um, I thought when we started this podcast I was gonna be very serious about it.
And then, I mean, I just, Kara and I just goof around and it’s fun for me. I really love it and I hope the people who listen to it. Can tell that we love it, especially, I love it and Carro loves it. I mean, even though they’re scared of everything, I think they enjoy just getting to spend time to each other and us giggling and laughing, you know?
So regardless of fame or no fame, I’m hoping that people can listen, be like, you know what? They really enjoy this. They’re not trying to make a ton of money off of it, or no money, honestly. And, you know, if something comes from it, that’s great. Uh, my way of life is I never want to be famous. I never want to be anything huge.
I wanna be mediocre. I’ve had such a wild, uh, past five or so years that I just want calmness. You know? I don’t want to be famous. Don’t want, I just want a good paying job and not a good pay, just a decent paying job. Want my kid, I want my husband. My little life and my podcast and my friends. You know, it’s, it’s a beautiful thing we’ve got going on here.
Um, So, I mean, I know that’s probably not what everyone wants to hear, but I and I, social media, I’ve said some stuff about it. Honestly, I’ve met so many amazing people on our little social, me, social media. It’s been so fun. Um, we got to do this with you, or I got to do this with you. Poor Carro got kicked off and can’t get back on.
And I got to do another podcast, uh, where we talked about the 2013 Evil Dad. And that was so freaking fun. Um, it was just, it’s been a great opportunity and I never thought that I would get to meet people and talk to people like this, you know? So it’s been, it’s been something that I think I needed because I’m a stay at home mom right now, and I had the pandemic child, you know, and everything was shut down.
And before that, I couldn’t drive because I was having seizures. And I mean, my life was just like, Lucky because I survived from everything and I have a family, but I felt very lonely at so many points. So I think this just really brought out that loneliness I was feeling, you know, so we’re doing, we were doing weekly.
We’re hoping people eventually send us in stories. We haven’t gotten that many in, and once that is, we’ll do, we’re biweekly, we went back to biweekly. But, if people start sending stories, we’ll go back to weekly. If you mind was sending stories, you can . Yeah, that’s just, that’s about it.
We’re just excited for doing this together. And, you know, Kara is an English major and, you know, looking to find a good job. And I, I start working when my son goes to school this year, this coming year. So, and I’m excited for it. I’m excited to be a real adult again. .
[01:05:16] Jeremiah: Yeah, I always tell people who ask me about podcasting or, or new of podcasting and stuff and the first thing I always say is like, make sure you’re passionate about it because most people are not going to get rich and famous off of it.
A lot of people aren’t even gonna make money off of it. So you really have to just love what you do. And, um, like I don’t even make that much money off it, to be honest. Then I get thousands and thousands of downloads. But, um, I just do it cuz I enjoy it. I love covering different things. I love hearing from people and their experiences, uh, like you coming on and sharing all your ghost experiences and stuff and things that you’ve encountered.
And I just like hearing different perspectives, things that I don’t hear regularly on TV or the radio or, uh, stuff like that. So it’s great to have all these minds on. To, to talk about that stuff, .
[01:06:19] Michelle: Oh yeah. It’s so great. Before I decided to do this, I was like, it’d be really cool to be able to go around, like my big town is Wilmington, but to go around Wilmington and just meet with people and talk to them and hear their stories.
Uh, and I would’ve loved to do that. So that was my other go-to if this wouldn’t have worked out with Carro, was just to kind of do a meet and greet type deal, or do one-on-one kind of meetings like this with like a bunch of random people who have had paranormal experiences. So that was my other go-to if car was like, no, I’m not doing this with you.
Cause I was like, I don’t know any friends who I would wanna do this with all the time. And who would also want to hear about paranormal all the time. So
[01:07:06] Jeremiah: possibly go to, you’re in Wilmington, North Carolina. Have you been to that um, museum of the Baar? in the old town.
[01:07:17] Michelle: Okay. Is it in Wilmington?
[01:07:19] Jeremiah: Yeah, it’s in Wilmington.
It’s in like the old section or whatever. Yeah. They have like this Museum of the Bizarre and it’s just, it’s not that big or that like fantastic. Mm-hmm. . But they have like a lot of cool like creepy stuff in there. Weird stuff in there, like ancient torture devices and
[01:07:36] Michelle: no, I haven’t been yet. My, uh, sister-in-law actually took my son , um, with her sons last year, but that actually used to be like, I think the Reptil Museum, like they used to have the, all the reptiles there.
If it’s the same building I’m thinking of. And I actually kind of completely forgot that it was there until you brought it up. Uh, it’s one of those things like you live in town, but you kind of just, you know, I’ve lived here my whole life and you just kind of don’t think about it, you know? Um, we did and I would like to do a dress tour eventually there, but it’s freaking expensive.
We did the uss. Battleship. Um, and I, I went on field trips there galore, but I found out recently they do ghost tours, but it’s like $200 per person. Wow. And I was like, uh, yeah, I don’t know. . So I would have to, you know, have a good paying job to be able to justify paying for an overnight stay like that, you know?
Um, but no, there’s beautiful things and there’s a small ghost trail hunting in Southport, which is close to Wilmington. And I’ve always thought about eventually going on that. But No, I mean that you would think with, like, honestly we have some dark history, especially in Wilmington. Um, you would think that all these like manner houses would have something going on, but they don’t, I mean, I’ve checked multiple times, you know?
I guess they’re just afraid to talk about the darkness of their, their history. And it seems like Wilmington, especially in Southport, it’s just like, ah, we don’t wanna talk about it. That’s the ugly business in the closet. We’re just gonna shove it back there and ignore it all. And I don’t think that’s the way to go, you know?
But own what happened. And then if you want to, you know, you could also throw in some haunted stuff in there too, cuz I mean, it’s gotta be super haunted. You know, there’s a couple of little stories I know from there. Like, um, there’s one called Mag Mel or something like that, but it’s about this like woman who had a bar in downtown Wilmington.
Like, I guess, I think it was like in the 17 hundreds, 18 hundreds, somewhere around there. It’s when sailors used to come up, I guess it would be the 18 hundreds sailors used to come up and evidently she was known as this like big booty woman who would take no shit. She was known for like biting mints ears off from brawls, and she’d put ’em in a jar behind her bar.
And um, evidently now she, like men when they’re drinking in downtown Wilmington, she ended up being shot outside of her bar. But men in downtown Wilmington Mill Wilmington can feel like in a presence there. And it’s always around where like Magus Magnus was, you know, so that’s one of the lores, and I haven’t read much into it, but there’s like a Cape Fear Mermaid and stuff, you know, so we’re just famous for all our TV shows and movie shot here,
[01:10:23] Jeremiah: I mean, there’s a lot of history there and mm-hmm. , it seems like wherever there’s history, there’s paranormal activity. Mm-hmm. .
[01:10:32] Michelle: Well, and like I said, I mean, it’s just, Wilmington especially, had a really crazy past if you really get into it. And uh, I’m just like, there has to be some kind of residual hauntings.
And then we have Old Brunswick Town here too. I mean, not in Wilmington, but off of Wilmington. That’s the first town I believe in North, North Carolina, but one of the first, if not the first town in North Carolina on the coast to be built up. There’s actually like stone surroundings of where the houses at houses were.
And then there’s actually, the church is still standing. It’s just like the bricks, but there’s no roof or windows on it of doors. But I mean, all of that stuff, I can’t imagine what you would see out there by yourself, especially in the evenings, you know?
[01:11:17] Jeremiah: Yeah, I would like to go to like an insane asylum, like one of those ones that shut down and abandoned.
Mm-hmm. . I know during the day though, not at night, I don’t know if I could handle that night, but I think it would be cool to go in and see like how it was . Cause they just are abandoned, you know? So, um, I think that would be really cool. And then I would like to go to the castles overseas, uh, was at the castle.
Prague in Czech Republic and that was really cool. But I’d like to go to like the castles in like Ireland and uh, Scotland and stuff like that. That would be cool. We
[01:11:57] Michelle: went to Northern Ireland, uh, for honeymoons in 2014 and I kind of liked ghost stuff. I wasn’t super into it like I am now and I wish I would’ve taken advantage of that because we went to, it was a castle that was like, kind of destroyed, you know?
So it was, but it was stunning. And then we also stayed in like this really old manor house and uh, the way it worked, it’s like there was a couple bedrooms and there’s a bathroom, so you had to walk to the bathroom. And every time I wake my husband, I’m like, you gotta get off. I’m not going to the bathroom by myself.
So this dark manor house. Uh, so I wish I would’ve been a little bit more into it, but it was cool cuz like we were super in a Game of Thrones at the time and we didn’t know that like most of the Game of Thrones was filmed in like that part of Northern Ireland. So we got to like visit all the, like the craziest.
Scenes and stuff like that, but it was absolutely stunning. But if I could go back again, I would go back with like my paranormal, loving mind and just be like, yeah, let’s eat this up.
[01:12:50] Jeremiah: So, um, if people wanna listen to your show or reach out to you, how can they go about doing that?
[01:12:57] Michelle: All right. So we have an Instagram, um, it’s a paranormal State of Mind podcast.
And then if you want to message us on there, you can, you know, do that. Um, you can add us and if you wanna email us, there’s a little email button on our page, or you can email us at a paranormal state of mind at Yahoo. Or you can also listen to us on Spotify fi and Apple. Um, we are a paranormal state of mind.
I don’t know if we have a podcast, but it should come up when you say this little purple picture with like a blonde haired person, a short brown hound person. Um, With a purple background, but yeah, you can follow us on there. Uh, check us out. We have a ton of fun, like I said, and we just did the 31 days of Halloween, so we’re at released a lot of like, I would say under 12 minute episodes for every day of October, which was exhausting, but it was really cool
Um, but yeah, if you guys wanna reach us there, uh, and we also did a podcast called Under the Floorboards. We did an episode with those guys. Uh, we talked about the 2013 Evil Dead. Um, and if we are on. This podcast and then we did a podcast with Tells at 3:00 AM which was on our page and his page. So it was a lot of fun.
It was very interesting. Um, so yeah, if you guys wanna check us out, that’d be awesome. Uh, if you like us, you can give us a rating and also make sure you just write every podcast you listen to, you know, but be nice about it cuz that really helps everybody out a lot. Follow people, you know, all the good things.
[01:14:31] Jeremiah: Uh, dropping a rating and a review is definitely helpful. Mm-hmm. ? Um, I’ve been trying to do it a lot more myself cuz there are times where I don’t do it and I’m like mm-hmm , I need to do it . Cause it does help. Yeah, it does help the creators. It helps you rank higher and uh, just let you know people are enjoying.
[01:14:53] Michelle: right? Well, I don’t do Apple, so I always feel bad cause I was like, man, but now Spotify has it to where you can give ’em like star, you know, you can’t comment. But, um, I’m, we have Apple, but I don’t ever go on there cause I’m afraid somebody’s gonna leave me and me comment, it’s gonna hurt my feelings. Uh, thankfully I’ve only met one or two kind of read people doing this.
Um, and it’s more about the fact that like my co-host is, you know, non-binary and that’s a huge deal for people. But I mean, as a whole it’s, it’s been great. Um, you know, not too, too many mean people, but yeah. So if you guys wanna check us out, that’d be awesome. Uh, yeah, that’s,
[01:15:33] Jeremiah: oh yeah. And I will, um, I’ll put links to your website and everything in the description of this show so people can get to you and hopefully send you those ghost stories and stuff that they’ve had.
Yeah. Ghost and Encounters guys.
[01:15:47] Michelle: It can be, I’m not huge on aliens, like not my favorite, but it can be aliens, it can be crypted, it can be ghost. You can make up a story just like, Hey, this is a fiction story. I love reading those things. Um, and we would love to read them. We love small businesses. So we will shout out your podcast, your small business.
You can stay anonymous. Uh, I don’t care. Just send me some emails and we’ll read ’em for you guys and uh, yeah, it’s great. It’s been a lot of fun, you know? Yeah.
[01:16:14] Jeremiah: Thank you for coming on and speaking with us. Uh, I enjoyed the conversation. We covered a lot of ground, but it was, uh, I think so it was fun and I always like hearing tales about people’s experiences and you’ve had quite a few, like the spirit that was over your son at the crib and mm-hmm.
your cat and. Spirit in the corner and stuff like that. So I like hearing all that stuff and I put in my memory bank and .
[01:16:44] Michelle: Yeah, it was really fun. I really appreciate having, having me on. I’m sorry car got lost in there, but I said the storm kind of seemed to get to him. Um, but yeah, it was, it was a ton of fun.
I really enjoyed it and I like your podcast so you will have a listener in me. Um, you know, and there still couple podcasts. I’m like, ah, , I’m not a huge fan of, but yours is really interesting. I like the, the wide range of everything you cover and I think you do a great job and you can tell that you really like what you’re doing.
I mean, you said you get a ton of downloads, so it’s obvious that people like it, but I mean, I think that’s great cuz I mean you put a lot of work into it from what I can tell. And I really enjoy
[01:17:23] Jeremiah: it. Yeah. I try to. Keep it a ma a mixed bag of stuff so it doesn’t get stale. So like I like how I can have an episode about Bigfoot and then next week it’s aliens and then the next week its fairies.
And so you get a little bit of everything,
[01:17:39] Michelle: right? I mean you can’t just be ghost all the time, you know? That’s how I feel too. It’s like, oh, there’s only so many times I can talk about like a lady, lady and white or , you know, the shadow man and stuff. So yeah, I think you do great and I really appreciate you taking the time to have me on here.