https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Paranormal
Ghosts of Ghettysburg
[00:00:00] Jeremiah: Hello, my fellow Terrestrials coming to you from an RV deep in the Carolina Mountains. Welcome to the What If They’re Wrong. Podcast. The podcast that wants you to question everything. Your reality is about to be shattered.
Hello and welcome to the What If the Wrong podcast, the podcast that wants you to question everything. I’m joined today by Victor and we’re gonna be talking about what’s he, what he’s into, um, ghost stuff and whatever else I want to throw Adam. So introduce him now. Hello, Victor.
[00:00:52] Victor: Hello, Jeremiah. Thank you for having me on.
Yeah,
thanks
[00:00:55] Jeremiah: for coming on. So, , what got you into all the fringe topics? The, you know, creepy crawly stuff, the , the unknown.
[00:01:05] Victor: Um, it’s a good question. Uh, as I’ve said before, my mother when I was very young, tried to have a, a seance with me. I was like, seven. It, it went awry. But I kind of felt like that’s where it all began.
And from there, I just spent a lot of my time as a teenager researching. . Then when I got a new adulthood, I had a life, but my life changed. I had a tragedy in it. And as such I thought, well, life is short. I should get back to doing what I’m passionate about. So here we are, .
[00:01:42] Jeremiah: So, uh, I think I saw you said you do like ghost tours.
Was that Yes. , is that the correct thing?
[00:01:50] Victor: Yes. Uh, I give ghost tours in Gettysburg. I’ve also given them in Philadelphia, Pennsylvania, and Atlantic City, New Jersey. .
[00:01:58] Jeremiah: Yeah. I lived in Lancaster, Pennsylvania for a while, so I’ve been to Gettysburg a couple times through school and after school and all. And um, there is like this weird feeling when you step on the grounds there.
It’s kind of like a somber feeling. And I know a lot of people talk about having that feeling. Do you get that feeling when you go.
[00:02:20] Victor: Uh, yeah, it’s kind of, kind of the norm, uh, when anyone goes there. Uh, the unofficial motto, and I saw this on a t-shirt, is Gettysburg is a ghost town with a history problem, but there’s different levels of concentrations in certain places of that energy.
So
[00:02:38] Jeremiah: what have you, have you experienced anything while you were there? Or like, uh, have you seen any ghosts or anything
[00:02:45] Victor: like, Yes. As a matter of fact, um, I’ll be putting out a video on my, uh, YouTube channel, which is destination spooky. I’ll be putting that out next week. But that could be made available whenever, uh, regarding a bridge that is there.
It’s a walking bridge, but it’s not sac covered bridge, which is what a lot of people think of. One kind of down the street from it. It’s like a half a mile away. It’s even more haunted in my opinion. And there’s other places too, I’ve. Feelings in the Jenny Wade House, for example. Now, Jenny Wade was the only civilian casualty of the Battle of Gettysburg, and her house is there, including where the holes in the door from the musket balls that ended up killing her still are.
And in the kitchen where she was making bread for the Union Army, I smelled bread before while I was on the. , how did,
[00:03:42] Jeremiah: uh, she end up being the only, you know, civilian casualty? Was she just like, I’m not leaving here during the war?
[00:03:49] Victor: And it was, uh, really bad luck. Um, her house was up the street and the Confederates kind of circled back around in the town and came through it from the north of the town.
And as such, they went by her original house. So she and her mother. and little brother ran sort of down the street to her sister’s house, her pregnant sister’s house, because her sister was very pregnant and this house was in the middle of the battlefield with sort of no one to guard it. So they were there to lend moral support.
Uh, no musket balls ever struck her original house funny enough. But her sister’s house was hit about 150 times. They couldn’t even leave the house because every time they’d open the door, they’d get hit by a musket. Balls repeat.
[00:04:39] Jeremiah: That’s crazy. Yeah. I’ve a, I haven’t heard that story, but, um, yeah, it’s crazy that she was the only civilian.
Like, it’s kind of interesting, like, oh, that’s her claim to fame kind
[00:04:52] Victor: of. Yeah. Um, it’s a, it’s tragic and just sort of unluck if you believe in that, but there’s a lot of stories involving the house itself, like as was said, a, a musket ball near. Hit her sister in the head. It sort of hit the headboard that her sister was resting on.
So to give Jenny more protection, her mother opened the door leading from the living room to the kitchen to give her an extra shield, and the ball that killed her ended up going through that door, the hole where the musket ball entered through. It said that if a single lady sticks her ring finger in through the hole, she’ll be married within the.
huh,
[00:05:38] Jeremiah: interesting. Through your experience and your tours and stuff, uh, is that house now haunted from your opinion? Yes.
[00:05:47] Victor: Yeah. Very haunted, particularly the Jenny Wade house. They encourage you to sort of, well, they don’t really encourage you to bring your own, uh, devices, but like they’ve encouraged, I know they’ve encouraged people to use EMF detectors before, at the very least, K two emf.
[00:06:06] Jeremiah: and they found stuff
[00:06:07] Victor: from that. Yeah. There’s, there’s stories that get told and that’s what the tour eventually becomes. It’s part history, but then as more things that happen on the tour get documented, that’s what the tour then becomes. It. It’s, here’s what happened here, but here’s what someone felt.
Here’s what happened to someone else. Here’s a story of a, uh, a lamp glass, I guess a lantern glass being thrown across the. in front of everyone. There’s people who stick their faces out the windows, uh, people who aren’t really there. All sorts of stories.
[00:06:41] Jeremiah: Yeah. That. Interesting. I’m, I’m not like a ghost hunter or like super into the ghost hunting stuff, so I, but I like hearing the stories about it.
I like hearing people’s experiences and, um, to hear different places, you know, around the country, around the world. And, uh, like I said, I know Gettysburg and I know when I stepped out onto the battlefields or whatever, I kind of felt that weird heaviness, like, uh, There was a lot of death there. And . Yeah.
And I hear from a lot of people the same experience.
[00:07:15] Victor: And the thing about it is I love the folklore more so than the investigations. Like a, to me, a ghost story is way better than being on a ghost hunt, but that’s just me. I consider myself more of a folklorist than I would a ghost hunter, though I do still.
Yeah.
[00:07:31] Jeremiah: So, um, is there any other folklore from the Gettysburg, uh, area? I mean, I’m sure there is, but like that you personally, like,
[00:07:41] Victor: my favorite is the Bell of Baltimore, and I’ve been telling this one lately to people. It’s a really good story. But a few months after the Battle of Gettysburg ended, a widow had stopped hearing from her husband right around the Battle of Gettysburg.
She stopped getting letters from him. She was from Baltimore, bell of b. Well, he was the breadwinner, so she took a train herself, which at the time was a faux pa. Like women didn’t travel by themselves, but she took a train herself up to Gettysburg to find his grave and get confirmation of his death. No one in Gettysburg, which was a union town at the time, strong union town, wanted her there.
And this is a thing about Gettysburg. This is part of the ghost problem. Confederate soldiers weren’t allowed to be buried in Gettysburg National Cemetery at first, so a lot of them are still buried all over the battlefields. We theorize that’s where the information, well not the information, the hauntings and stuff still come from, but the bell of Baltimore gets to the battlefield and she wasn’t allowed to rest in any of the houses in the town.
So she sets up a lean tube out in the forest of one of the battle. Little makeshift tent. And every night she would take a lantern and start looking at the graves, the the kind of jerry rigged up markers to see if her husband’s name was on any of them. And during the day, she would scavenge through the town’s trash to eat, and the dress she had brought to Gettysburg began to get ranted and worn because she couldn’t do any laundry.
No one would let her, and she began to go mad. This was right around the, the Copes Hill area, if I’m not mistaken. Over time, they began to see her less and less. Finally, she stopped coming into town to get provisions out of the garbage. But then a few weeks after she stopped coming into town, people started seeing the lantern again at night.
So a search party went out to Lpci to look for her. They found her tent. They found what little food she had. , which she was never found, although they still see that lantern at night. And while giving walking tours in Gettysburg, remember Cemetery Hill and especially Cols Hill are closed to the Public National Park while giving ghost tours.
And I used to end on that stop. People would see a lantern off in the distance as I was talking, I’ve been stopped three times giving that to her because people saw a lantern. Think of it, what?
[00:10:20] Jeremiah: Yeah, it’s interesting for sure. Um, and the whole Gettysburg thing, like you said, like the confederates couldn’t be, you know, uh, traditionally buried or whatever, so they kind of had, were makeshift in the battlefield or whatever.
Yeah. And. , have you had anyone or you personally see like any type of ghosts or spirits, like on actual battlefields?
[00:10:51] Victor: People do all the time. I have yet to see one. Uh, but like I said, people have seen them when I was giving the walking tour, especially on the cemetery Hill area, and they would like, beg me to take them and I’m like, well, I, I do respect park rangers and they’re just gonna kick us out,
So unfortunately I cannot Now, if the tour ends, do whatever you want to. , but people have seen them even on my tour.
[00:11:15] Jeremiah: Yeah. And I know it’s probably a big destination for Ghost Hunters too, so I’m sure you get a lot of them coming through.
[00:11:22] Victor: Oh, yeah. All the time. Uh, I remember, uh, ghost Adventures Club was one of the first that came through, and then it just started to kind of snowball from there, the town and the, the buildings and the people who own the building.
Are open to it. You know, they, they have blocks for ghost hunting investigations.
[00:11:42] Jeremiah: That’s pretty cool that they’re allowing that. And you know, the people that want to get into that sort of thing have, you know, places to do that and experiment and stuff like that. So, um, find that pretty cool that the town like, lets them do
[00:11:57] Victor: that.
Yeah. And more and more are, are catching on to that. I just watched a, a live last. from a paranormal group called UH, three Souls Paranormal. Shout out to those guys. They got to check out Wolf’s Hill, which is a place no one really gets to investigate. I think they’re just now opening up and they were, if not the first, one of the first to investigate.
Had some interesting responses. That’s pretty
[00:12:21] Jeremiah: cool. I’ll have to check them out. , uh, for sure. Have you heard of, uh, dioxide Media? I think they did a documentary called GOs Gettysburg.
[00:12:31] Victor: Um, it doesn’t ring a bell, but I might’ve passed, or I might’ve come across it in passing. .
[00:12:37] Jeremiah: Oh, okay. I was just wondering cuz Tyler and Chris, they do documentaries and uh, one of theirs was the Goig Gettysburg, so I wasn’t sure if they ran across you or anything like that.
[00:12:50] Victor: Oh, not yet. Uh, but, you know, might happen someday the way things go in this sort of, uh, hobby
[00:12:56] Jeremiah: field. So you said you cover Philadelphia as well? Uh, yes. What kind of things do you like about Philadelphia that like Drew you. well,
[00:13:07] Victor: um, adjacency to where I grew up. I grew up in Delaware County, so it’s, it’s right next to Philadelphia, but in giving tours in the town, it’s just kind of got a, a feel to it.
Whereas Gettysburg, the bulk of its history takes place over three days. In 1863, Philadelphia is over 300 years by
[00:13:31] Jeremiah: this. Yeah, there’s definitely a lot of history there. I know they originally were gonna make it the capital of the United States, but decided not to, and um, I’m familiar with Philadelphia as well.
I’m lived and grew up in Wilmington, Delaware, so not that far away. .
[00:13:50] Victor: So I lived in Newark for a time. Oh yeah? Yep. That’s how you know, because I pronounced it right. .
[00:13:58] Jeremiah: Yes, I totally know that area as well. Yeah, I like Delaware. I’m kind of miss some of the stuff there, uh, in North Carolina now, but I love it down here too.
But , it’s different. What part? Um, I’m near Charlotte. Oh, okay. You’re
[00:14:15] Victor: down there. So I’m inland here. Here’s a funny, ironic thing. My family’s from Mount Air right up there at the north border next to Virginia.
[00:14:23] Jeremiah: Oh, yes, I know that area too. I’ve been. Mayberry itself. Yep. And, uh, there’s a lot of stuff down here too.
Um, I know we have District 12 from the Hunger Games. Not too far from where I live. I’ve been there and, uh, it’s pretty cool. And I’m sure they got their own, you know, folk lores and tales and stuff like that. And . I think there’s a town like an hour and a half from here that’s just abandoned. Just an abandoned town.
And I’m sure there’s stories around that too. There’s one place I want to go in Pennsylvania. I’ve never got a chance to go. But The Centre, have you ever been there?
[00:15:02] Victor: Oh yeah. Uh, two or three times. Yeah.
[00:15:05] Jeremiah: I really want to go there cuz I love the like Silent Hill games and I know it was kind of like crafted after that town, so I would love to go there and experience that.
[00:15:16] Victor: Oh, totally. Uh, I actually did see the fire underneath the, uh, road one night, the abandoned highway up there. I could still see the flames that were shooting up. It was during the rain. I saw a couple of houses, what two or three are left that are leaning and about to fall over. I still have those pictures.
Yeah,
[00:15:35] Jeremiah: it’s pretty crazy that the fire’s been burning for like this long and they expect it to keep burning for, I don’t know how long, but, um, Yeah, it’s just an odd, odd situation right there. But it adds to the creepiness. The spookiness of it. .
[00:15:51] Victor: Now, have you ever been to the, and I don’t mean to make the interview about you, last question, but have you ever been to the Devil’s stomping grounds down there in North Carolina?
[00:15:59] Jeremiah: I have not, but that sounds
[00:16:02] Victor: interesting. I’ll give you more info about it. I wanna say it’s in Asheville, but I could be wrong, and it’s something I’d have to look up as we’re speaking. . Yeah, that’s one I want to get to. When I get down south this upcoming year, I take a lot of little road trips to haunted places to kind of see what the big score is.
And at the very least, you know, I could see, I could walk where a legend once was. .
[00:16:30] Jeremiah: Yeah, definitely. I love taking road trips. Iove going to like abandoned places. I don’t know, something draws me to the abandoned places and I just like things that time has forgotten, kind of and so yeah, that’s definitely my type of thing too.
What are some cool places that you’ve been that really like stuck with you?
[00:16:51] Victor: Well, have you ever heard of Dudley Town, Connecticut? . All right. Dudley Town is a good one. And it’s what people said was going to happen to, it was kind of my inspiration to get started. So Dudley Town is a cursed village. There’s no village there anymore, but it’s in Connecticut, it’s in the woods on a hill in East Cornwall, and people ac can actually take walks through it now.
But when the town was settled, it said there was a curse put. people kept dying and the founders of the town had a lot of misfortune over the runs of their lives. And the curse continued right up until the last house was settled in, I want to say the 1950s when a doctor built a cabin, and by cabin I mean like a luxury ish home for the time, but with a cabin type feel out in the woods for he and his wife to live to.
He went out of town to New York for a. . When he came back she was completely mad. She was talking about friends she’d made in the woods that were coming to visit her later that night. And he had her committed and I believe she died in the mental health hospital. Though I could be mixing my cases up. I’m also thinking about number 50, Berkeley Square, cuz you know, Greg and Ash had me on and I talked about that with them.
But I did get to go to Dudley Town, which was very important to me and used to be completely off. actor Dan Akroyd, who is really big into the supernatural, called it the scariest place on Earth. And he is been to a lot. And I went there and I did experience it a bit. Now I’m gonna put up something about that later too.
So
[00:18:38] Jeremiah: what, um, I have to ask what’s so like scary about it? If it’s supposed to be the scariest place on Earth. I’d just get curious.
[00:18:47] Victor: Well, to me, , have you ever seen the film or read the short story? 1408 by Stephen King? Yes. And they had the movie
[00:18:56] Jeremiah: with Samuel Jackson.
[00:18:58] Victor: Yeah. And John Cusack. And the whole point is it was a writing exercise form, but it’s a concentrated room, completely supernatural, with no rhyme or reason.
You never learn why it’s the way it is. You just learn everything that happened there. One person’s experience nearly going. and escaping the room. Delhi town is kind of like that. You walk in through dark entry road and you begin to to climb through the woods heading towards the hill. If you have equipment with you, it will start to act funny.
Electrical equipment, especially, I’ve had my, uh, spirit box go nuts. There’s old remnants of like cars and stuff from the 1950s and skeletons of them still out in the. And the farther I would get up to that hill, I suddenly felt like my brain was on fire and like I was being pulled from my ankles and then pulled another direction from my neck.
Now mind you, I’m really high up, but I lost all sense of direction and everything like that, and I had to run down the hill half out of it, feeling like I’m 11 feet tall, but like I’m one of those. Inflatable tube guys out in front of a car, lot . I had to do that and basically kind of jump off the side of this hill to get out of there.
It really is a concentrated zone of weird. There are stories that people come in and take the dirt and the rocks and stuff just to have a souvenir. Thankfully I didn’t do this. The dirt and rocks get mailed back in envelopes to the park services office with little letters saying the stories were. , it’s cursed.
Take it back and put it back for me please. And they never elaborate what happens in their lives or anything, but it, it really is kind of like that, the overwhelming feelings at the very least. Now again, luckily I didn’t take a souvenir with me and I’m glad I did not, uh, take a souvenir. Uh, I also did not do one of the things I love to do on a paranormal investigation, which is dividing.
and that’s where you speak to the spirits using the dividing rods. I’m glad I never got to do that because I kind of don’t wanna know the. .
[00:21:20] Jeremiah: Yeah, I think um, stuff like that’s better left, you know, alone . Yeah. And that’s pretty wild cause I’ve never heard that story and I think it’s, uh, very interesting about the people taking dirt and then mailing it back.
I mean, you really gotta be freaked out to mail some dirt back .
[00:21:40] Victor: Yeah, definitely. Uh, otherwise I’ve been to Area 51. I’ve been to Roswell, I’ve been to the Goldfield Hotel, not inside, but the town of Goldfield. Um, I went through a lot of California. I’ve been to the win. Excuse me, I’ve been to the Winchester House.
I’ve been to, what was the Haunted Toys Rs. I can talk more about that, I suppose. And uh, I went through the same, yeah, let’s get into that. Cause.
[00:22:06] Jeremiah: Toys are us. I grew up as a toys us kid, and I know they’re not really around anymore, but yeah. Let’s talk about the Toys Us House .
[00:22:15] Victor: Sure. It’s actually a, uh, an r e i now the outdoor, uh, outfitter and I had to look that up, but it’s this unassuming r e i in the middle of a shopping center.
However, that R EI used to be a Toys Rs before they went out of business. It was known as the Sunny Vale Toys R. And it was one of the most haunted places in the United States. There was Poltergeist activity all over the back room when night fell. I want to say that the television show version of Buffy the Vampire Slayer, which is named Sunny Dale, I think is a reference to that.
But I got to see that at the R a I. Um, I used the bathroom. They wouldn’t let. Do much of anything. I think they thought I was there to shoplift, so I kind of just walked around with a guard following me and then I left. But at least I got to go to the Haunted Toys R Us.
[00:23:06] Jeremiah: Yeah, that’s, uh, that’s interesting too, for sure.
And, uh, you wouldn’t think, you know, toys R Us would be haunted, but hey, I guess they can, ghosts can be anywhere, basically.
[00:23:19] Victor: Yeah. You’d be. and I’ve got, that’s why I started getting into YouTube and stuff just to sort of share my stories and to hear other people’s stories. Yeah, so
[00:23:28] Jeremiah: I’m in like a new construction development, so all the houses are new and they’re like tearing up land to put these houses in and stuff.
And there is a slave cemetery that they uncovered and. They had to halt, you know, digging up and all and yeah, came that this is a sleeve cemetery and now there’s like a black fence around it and no one’s allowed to build there. And you could go there, there’s, you don’t really see anything. It’s just, you know, trees and grass and stuff.
But it’s just very interesting that, and then there was this lady who was, I want to buy the house next to the sleep cemetery. And she was like super adamant about it. And they’re like,
[00:24:14] Victor: okay, . It’s never a good sign when someone wants to do that, I don’t think. I mean, maybe they’re just enthusiasts. Yeah. I
[00:24:22] Jeremiah: don’t know.
I, it’s not something I would want to do, but , hopefully they’re not into like Voodoo
[00:24:27] Victor: or something. . Yeah, . As long as they don’t turn it into like the clown motel out in Topa, which is. . Well, in my opinion, there’s nothing behind it. No one reported anything in that area prior to the clown motel moving in, and then it kind of became haunted for the sake of being haunted.
But that’s just me. . It’s
[00:24:49] Jeremiah: funny you mentioned that cuz I had a friend just send me something over Facebook and it was that clown motel where like they have the creepy clown pictures in the rooms and they have like a clown souvenir shop. And I was like, what is this place, ?
[00:25:05] Victor: Uh, it’s a, it’s a roadside motel in to pop.
There is a haunted hotel in Topa just down the street. And Topa is a mining city in Nevada. Halfway between Reno and. and the guy bought the motel and he put in the clown motif himself, called it the clown motel. It’s a way to catch eyes, but then stories got out after that, that the grounds were haunted and it is next to an old mining cemetery.
I’ve been to that cemetery, I’ve been to the clown motel, nothing. But that’s again, just me. Yeah. I’m
[00:25:40] Jeremiah: sure people make up stuff just because you know, a lot of people are freaked out by clowns and I don’t know if you remember like 10, 12 years ago, I think it was, they had like people dressing up as clowns and pretending to be killers and stuff like that.
And like scaring people on roadside and
[00:25:58] Victor: stuff. , yeah. The clowns in the woods. The clowns. Yeah, that, that, what a time to be alive. That was .
[00:26:04] Jeremiah: Yeah. I was like, oh my gosh, what is wrong with people? Uh, I was like, this could turn really bad for both the people that are clowns and the bystanders that are, you know, try they, they’re try, they’re trying to freak out ,
[00:26:18] Victor: right?
Like something like that’s not going to end well one way or the other. So good that it kind of petered out. Knock on wood.
[00:26:27] Jeremiah: Yeah. I’m glad that it didn’t last too long cuz I was. Either one of these clowns is gonna get killed because some someone’s gonna get freaked out and shoot at ’em or something, or, or the clown’s gonna go too far and someone’s gonna get killed because the clown’s playing too much of a role.
And so, yeah. I’m glad it was short . Yeah. So, uh, what do you think causes places to be haunted, like from your opinion?
[00:26:55] Victor: Well, and uh, I covered this another time. My personal belief on the afterlife is that heaven and hell, and I’m doing that with my hands, aren’t above and below us. It’s sort of all around us.
Uh, my own theory is that the afterlife is just time going on a circle, just going around and around. I base this on a, a few things, some hunts I’ve been on and something, a tour. Once said at a stop known as the John Rupp house in Gettysburg. I’ll go into John Rupp for a second cuz it really ties the story together.
But yeah, go ahead. John Rupp was a civilian in the battle. He lived about two blocks from Jenny Wade. Funny enough, his house is still there. There’s still bullet holes in it and Confederate snipers set up across the street. now, the first day of the battle, he and his family went across the street to the wealthy house, along with a couple of other people nearby.
His neighbor, Mr. McCreedy, and a bunch of them, and they were sort of in the basement. There was a trough there that they could survive for a night. So after the first day of the battle, things kind of calmed down. For the moment. It was like the eye of the storm. The RUP family snuck back across the street.
John noticed there were confederate snipers up in the windows of Mr. Wealthy’s house. They had taken a point, brief aside, those confederate snipers are set to haunt the upstairs rooms at the wealthy house, which does have a lot of energy in it. So John gets across the street and the then sends his family, his wife, and his kids, uh, down nearby to ride the battle out.
What John decides to do is live in the basement for the next two. surviving only on preserves and water, and his plan was he was going to stay down there eating peaches or whatever, jam until he didn’t hear any gunfire anymore. Finally, the gunfire stopped. John Rupp goes up upstairs, looks at his house.
It’s a shambles. It’s been ransacked covered in bullet holes, and if I recall correctly, there. Two dead union soldiers on his porch or two dead confederates, and in the backyard was one dead confederate or union soldier. He buried all three on his property. He then made some general repairs and brought his family home.
About a week after his family came home, his kids kept waking him up at night. They slept at, they slept in the attic. They told them there’s hornets outside of our room. We can hear ’em at the windows for a couple of days. John. Continued to hunt for this hornet’s nest, but he never saw them and he never heard them, but his kids kept waking them up.
So finally, John Rupp gets his neighbor, Mr. McCreedy, to come over, look around the the property for this hornet’s nest. He’s driving him mad. They don’t see anything, but Mr. McCreedy looks at John R in the eyes and he says, John, do you ever wonder if somewhere the battle’s still going on? And that’s because the hornets were actually.
the minnet balls from the muskets that were flying into the house over and over again, even though no one was firing them. It said that John Rupps house is a time gate. This is what I’m taking from another tour guide. I have a picture that might verify that I can send it to you after we’re done talking here.
Feel free to put it up or don’t. But the guide would then go into Einstein’s definition of relativity, which is. . Sometimes there are forces at work that we can’t see with our naked eye. I talked about this with, um, with Ash and Greg, but like gravity. You drop a pen, the pen falls down. Did you see the gravity?
No. You saw its effects. You saw its effects. You trust that it’s there even though you can’t see it. And Einstein theorized that the fourth dimension, because we live in the third, the fourth dimens. is space and time, and to build on that, I’ve seen stuff about string theory that leads to maybe there being up to 11 additional dimensions, but I don’t have that on me now.
So my basis of the afterlife is when we die, our energy just sort of stays in the same spot, but somewhere else, if that makes sense. Like right here beside me and right here beside me could be someone else at any given. and they can move and freely, so anywhere could be haunted based on that. You can get a response from anyone based on that.
Is
[00:31:50] Jeremiah: that like the, uh, parallel universe theory, or is that like more the, there is no passive future. There’s just like the, now everything’s all in. . Like everything’s all together in this moment in time. , there is like no real past, no real future. It’s just we’re in the now, but you know, we have recollections of what we think is the past or the future, whatever.
[00:32:19] Victor: I don’t think the second one though. I don’t rule out anything. Um, it could be like parallel universe theory, but I just kind of think it’s a circle. I think the afterlife is, uh, we live our lives and we. and we keep, and then when we die, we start living our lives again, and then we die in the same spot over and over and over again.
And I think that’s okay, but that’s why you get more spiritual activity, in my opinion, from someone who died tragically young than say, someone who lived the full life because the tragically young one’s gonna A, have more energy, and B, be more P. Because they don’t have the same amount of lifespan to be doing the same thing over and over again.
[00:33:03] Jeremiah: Yeah. And it would definitely make, uh, sense as far as, it seems like a lot of ghosts that haunt houses or buildings, whatever, seem to be just living like they were. , uh, you hear a lot about, I’ve talked with other ghost hunters and stuff and it’s like they were working in the mines and they died, but if you go down there, the ghost activity, it’s like they’re still working in the mines.
Like they never knew that they died. Yeah, and same thing with houses, like people haunting houses cuz they live there or, um, they died there and they just kind of like keep going like you.
[00:33:44] Victor: Yeah. And uh, I have that when I went on a ghost tour at Pennhurst, well, a ghost hunt at Pennhurst. Excuse me. The guys there who are very good, they did something interesting to me.
And this was younger when I really, before I really got into it, I expected this, this evil place, this CD evil place where all these bad things happen, but the. . It was just like, well, so it goes and they acted sort of like teachers and guidance counselors to the spirits they talked to. Like often they would ask, because this is mostly children, they would ask, uh, what they had for lunch today, and they would get a response.
[00:34:25] Jeremiah: just acting like normal everyday life.
[00:34:29] Victor: Yeah. And that’s it. So that’s what I think, and it’s up for speculation, but that’s what I think.
[00:34:35] Jeremiah: It definitely makes sense. Uh, it definitely follows some of the things I’ve heard from other researchers and ghost hunters and stuff like that, that, you know, it seems like when you die you just either pass on to the next place or continue whatever you were doing, and.
Maybe there is multiple levels. I know they’ve talked about, you know, in biblical references, like the seventh Heaven or whatever. And so it’s like, is there seven dimensions or, you know, and they talk about, you know, I, I don’t like turn everything biblical, but it kind of ties in with everything. It’s like they talk.
You know, the angels falling from their estate to our plane or realm or whatever. So I totally believe there is like other dimensions that we just can’t see, and I think they are happening at the same time that we’re existing here. We’re just having a different experience.
[00:35:37] Victor: Yeah. And that’s where you get those original, um, glitch in the matrix stories, which is a term that’s.
Gummed up and, you know, uh, thrown around incorrectly and then changed and whatnot Over the years, uh, with Glitch in the Matrix, starting as people who believe that we really are, uh, a society locked in, feeding computers somewhere at the end of the world, which is the plot of the original one. Not just spoil it for anyone but
Then it became, you know, it became sort of for. , and this is refers to Charles Fort’s research of experiences that would happen that science didn’t wanna touch because either there’s a hell of a reasonable explanation for it or there is no explanation for it. And that’s okay. And that’s sort of evolved, in my opinion, to from Fordism.
uh, the glitch and the matrix stories, and they’re a heck of a read. If you ever go to
[00:36:40] Jeremiah: Reddit, oh, I’m in a glitches of the Matrix Facebook group and I hear some crazy things and I think some people don’t quite understand exactly what it is, cuz they’ll post something and it’s like, that’s not really a glitch, that’s just a weird occurrence.
And, but, There are weird things and maybe it explains deja vu too, um, that you feel like you’ve already been to a place even though you know you haven’t been. It could all tie into that as
[00:37:08] Victor: well. Absolutely, and I’ve, I’ve theorized on that as well. I,
[00:37:13] Jeremiah: I really do. Cuz there’s been times where I’ll walk into a place or be in a situation I’m.
I feel like I’ve done this before, but I know I haven’t cuz I’ve never been here. But it’s just that feeling of like, this is too familiar. It’s wild.
[00:37:31] Victor: Right. And I have a story about Philadelphia regarding that. Funny enough, cuz you mentioned earlier, um, they thought about making Philadelphia the capitol, but they didn’t.
Here’s the real story. So Philadelphia was the capital for a year, basically, uh, after the Revolut. . Once they ratified the constitution, everybody ran to New York, to Manhattan Island because we owed all these countries a lot of money. We had nothing. We ran from creditors, which is the American way. came back after a year to, to Philadelphia, and the president’s mansion was the first White House.
that’s a whole nother story altogether. I could spend two hours talking about that cuz it’s a mess. Literally, they tore it down and built a bathroom over it. But that out of the way. Um, right there on Independence Row with old Congress Hall, that’s where Congress met. And you had the House of Representatives on the first floor of the lower chamber and you had the Senate on the second floor, the upper chamber you had Independence Hall, which.
kind of the capitol building for its time. And then you had Old City Hall, which was actually the Supreme Courts chambers. So it was for a year. The Capitol? Well, no it wasn’t. It was for longer than a year. Sorry. Excuse me. And John Adams, when he served his term, served it in Philadelphia as the president.
It was Hamilton and Jeff. who got into an argument about the first bank of the United States. This was Hamilton’s banking idea to collect money to rebuild after the war and have a centralized bank that would protect smaller private banks just in case they failed. Jefferson wanted no part of this famous, private, et cetera, et cetera, and they would go back and forth and back and forth and back and forth, and Washington couldn’t take it.
So Hamilton gets his first. But he makes a deal with Jefferson. Give me this bank. We’ll move the capital down to Washington DC in 1800 and that’s when the White House got built so that Jefferson could be closer to Monticello. That’s really it. What it was, we were trying to appease Jefferson.
[00:39:49] Jeremiah: Yeah, I did, I did not know that Cuz um, unfortunately this is gonna sound bad, but I’m not too big on like American history.
I’m. Ancient history, world history, very fair.
[00:40:02] Victor: But um, the funny thing, oh, sorry. I do have a, there’s a part B I know I sounded conclusive, but there was No, no,
[00:40:07] Jeremiah: no, you’re good. Continue.
[00:40:09] Victor: Um, the first bank, Hamilton oversaw it until he and, uh, and Aaron Berg got into a bit of a curfuffle. After Hamilton was brought down by Burr, he went back to.
He went back to the first Bank of the United States, even as it changed from the first bank to Steven Gerard’s offices to Gerard’s Bank till finally being closed later after being bought out by Mellon Bank in the eighties. Hamilton would make regular, regular appearances throughout the building all the time.
and he would sort of look in on people as they were working and if they weren’t working hard enough, there was Poulter guys to activity. He would knock papers off the desk so they would have to pick ’em up so they could earn their check. He’s like the world’s worst boss, but from the afterlife, , they actually blessed.
They blessed the building twice to get ’em to stop, and it never worked. He wasn’t like an evil spirit. He’s just a dick and a terrible boss. . He was going through his own motions. He still had his attitude about work and money. And that’s what I mean, like it kind of is like we go back to doing our own thing.
To me. So
[00:41:26] Jeremiah: if you could go anywhere in the world and money wasn’t an issue, where’s the one place you like would absolutely want to go to? Like experience either the supernatural or just the folklore? ,
[00:41:41] Victor: I’ve gotta get to Sylvania. That’s the first one that comes up. I think, you know, if you’re really into it, we should all get to make that pilgrimage.
Um, I’d like to see Japan one day. I do wanna see that haunted like Asylum Island that ghost of ventures got around to going to, but nobody else ever gets to go to. There are no boats through it or anything. I would love to spend the night on that island just off the top of.
[00:42:07] Jeremiah: Yeah, I think I saw something on TV about that.
Uh, or on YouTube or something. It’s like a abandoned island in Japan that it’s like a ghost town or whatever, but no one really goes there. ,
[00:42:20] Victor: well, they have that too, I wanna say. That was from a different, uh, nuclear reactor. Then the one that, that melted down during the ts. . But um, there’s this island off the coast of Italy somewhere where they built a mental health hospital and the patients Oh, yes, yes.
Were allegedly abused. Yeah, that’s the one I want to get to. It’s just supposed to be one of the worst places on earth, but the only way to get there is by boat. If you can pay an Italian captain to take you over there and they never come back that night, you gotta wait until morning. So you’re on the island the whole night,
Yeah. You’re sleeping there .
[00:42:58] Jeremiah: Yeah. I don’t know if I. A scaredy cat myself. So I don’t know if I could go through with that, but it would be interesting
[00:43:07] Victor: just at least to say I could, I did it like even if lad the Impaler doesn’t haunt his castle, I’d love to spend the night there just to say I could.
[00:43:16] Jeremiah: Yeah, Sylvania definitely just cause it’s so rich in folklore.
like all that, like Dracula, everything. You just, when you say Sylvania, people automatically think, you know, spooky Dracula. .
[00:43:33] Victor: Yeah. It’s been going around lately that um, people are selling vampire hunter kits, . These were real kits. They used to sell them. If you were taking a boat to Europe, they would sell.
Uh, Ripley’s, believe it or not, had one before they closed down in Atlantic City and the Mure Museum in Philadelphia has one.
[00:43:54] Jeremiah: Wow. That’s pretty wild. . Yeah, that they would kick that out. That’s pretty
[00:44:01] Victor: cool actually. . Yeah, I’d give one if I had the money for that too. I’d do a lot of stuff if I had money, so wouldn’t we
[00:44:07] Jeremiah: all?
Yeah, for sure. Yeah. Japan’s another place I want to go. I want to go out to the. like mountainside and stuff where they have the like Samurai Kobos or whatever they’re called, . That would be fun. And I’m sure there’s haunting out there too. So .
[00:44:26] Victor: Oh yeah. J Ja Japan has like the best folk war. I’m, I’m sure there’s others I just haven’t researched as much, but Japan has an incredible folklore for that stuff and like I would want to hear about it sort of first.
[00:44:41] Jeremiah: Yeah. I did a uh, episode about like the 10 most haunted place or the most evil places on earth or whatever, and I would cover the Japanese suicide forest, which is another. Weird anomaly that people just seem to be drawn to this forest to commit suicide or whatever. Yeah. And they said that, um, in the past, like distant past, that they would do, uh, infanticide there or something where they would take like deform children or elderly people that couldn’t care for themselves and just leave them out in the woods to rot or whatever.
So it’s, yeah, those stories. Yeah. So I gotta ask you, and it’s not ghosts related at all, but I just wanna get your take. Uh, I like asking random people. What is your, uh, thought on the whole Alien and U f O
[00:45:32] Victor: phenomenon? Oh, um, I’ve seen three UFOs , as a matter of fact. Um, and I can can touch on that too, but, um, yeah, I believe it.
I, I’ve seen them. I actually, if I can find it, I recorded. on video. Oh, wow. Yeah, so there’s that. Uh, I am also on a U F O watch list as of 2020 and that’s not good, but I don’t know. , so pseudonym Victor Johnson isn’t my real name, but there you have it. It was actually, go on.
[00:46:12] Jeremiah: No, you
[00:46:13] Victor: can. . Okay, because I just thought you actually might know where this place is.
The first one was actually in Chestertown, Maryland. It was about 70 miles from Wilmington. And yeah, I was, yeah. And I was down there to see Talula bank Head’s grave, cuz it’s supposed to be haunted by her. Like if you asked her to sing, she’ll sing something. And if you leave whiskey for and turn around, it’ll be, it’ll have been drank once you are turned around.
So I didn’t get anything there. , seeing her grave was fun. On the way back there were these lights in the sky and they kept just flying by. So I pull over to look at it and at the time my camera couldn’t capture them, but I hop on Twitter and people in Kent, Maryland are going, does anyone else see those lights in the sky?
And the next thing you know, , anybody who tweeted about it, we ended up on that watch report. And then there was another one out in Newport. It’s weird. , the Delaware area got so many U F O things like once you left, funny enough, but that was where I recorded the one U F O. It was over someone’s house while I was delivering a pizza to ’em.
Lastly, I saw one in Topa Nevada, which would’ve been where it was in the sky. Would’ve been right over area 51, funny enough. So who knows? . That’s really cool.
[00:47:43] Jeremiah: Yeah. I have not seen a U F O myself. Um, I just told my wife tonight, I was like, I kind of want to get hypnotized and see if I’ve ever been abducted
Cause you
[00:47:54] Victor: never know. Stuff costs. Yeah. But the problem is that stuff costs like $300. Like, you know, uh, I’m not in or I’m all. regression therapy and as well as past life. But it, there’s so much money that goes into that. Like take it down to 50 bucks. Yeah, sure. Let’s see what I got in there. But
[00:48:12] Jeremiah: yeah. Yeah, the money aspect for sure.
Right. But I think it would be cool if, you know, like you said, if it was 50 bucks and I could go do it and see for sure, cuz I had like a near death experience type thing. But I kind of wonder. , was it near death? Was it an abduction? I really don’t know. I think it was a near death, but the more I like hear other abduction stories and stuff, I’m like possibly , but I don’t know.
But it would be cool to to find out. But yeah, I don’t know if I’d be willing to pay $300 for it. .
[00:48:52] Victor: Oh yeah. I mean, that’s a lot. .
[00:48:56] Jeremiah: And then also, I don’t know if I’d want to know, like at the same time I want to know. I don’t know if I want to know. Cuz that might bring up a whole new set of like trauma and questions.
And
[00:49:08] Victor: it really is something, once you start piecing this stuff together, it’s overwhelming at first, but you know, then gets easier. Thankfully.
[00:49:17] Jeremiah: And then I’ll ask you again and then we’ll wrap it up. Is, uh, what are your thoughts on like big. and the whole like Sasquatch thing.
[00:49:28] Victor: Well, I’ve never experienced decrypted, so that’s my least amount of experience.
But it would be cool if Bigfoot existed. I’ve been to a Bigfoot museum and I need to see more mall for it. Do I think there is a missing link? Yes, cuz. Well, I think that anything is possible, Absolut. .
[00:49:51] Jeremiah: If you ever go to Wilmington, Delaware, I mean, not Wilmington, Delaware, Wilmington, North Carolina. There is a, uh, in the Old Town section, there’s a little shop there.
It’s like a museum. It’s called like the Museum of the Bazaar. and, um, they have some really cool stuff in there, like creepy stuff and weird, uh, things from experiments and letters from serial killers, like all kinds of weird stuff in there. And we went, we went through it and it was really interesting to see some of the stuff they had in there
[00:50:28] Victor: would.
Funny enough, would you believe that Wilmington, Delaware also has an oddity shop? No, I did
[00:50:36] Jeremiah: not know
[00:50:36] Victor: that. Up in Arden. It’s called the Odd Auditorium. They’ve only opened in the last four or five years, but they’re very nice. I know the owners, Beth and Nick and yeah, they have an oddity shop. They have this, uh, board game dedicated to HH Holmes that they sell and a bunch of other stuff there.
Haunted dolls, everything you can think of.
[00:50:58] Jeremiah: Yeah, next time I go up there, I’ll definitely swing by there and see them because my brother still lives in Delaware. Uh, okay. When I go up next time, I’ll, I’ll make a plan to stop by there and check it out.
[00:51:11] Victor: Marsh Road, across the street from the Papa John’s right there.
The, I
[00:51:16] Jeremiah: think I know
[00:51:16] Victor: exactly where that is. Mm-hmm. used to be a sandwich shop, so
[00:51:20] Jeremiah: Yeah. I’ll definitely have to check it out. So, uh, if anyone wants to get a ahold of you or talk to you, how can they go about doing so?
[00:51:29] Victor: Well, uh, the best way right now is through YouTube. I am once again, youtube.com at Destination Spooky.
Uh, that’s the little travel ish, uh, weird thing I’m doing. I’m also on Facebook as, uh, Victor Scott Johnson. You can find Reverend vs Johnson on both Reddit and Instagram, but I don’t check those much lately. So,
[00:51:53] Jeremiah: and then if they’re in, uh, Gettysburg, they can get a tour as well. I’m. .
[00:51:58] Victor: Oh, absolutely. But that one I’m gonna keep a little close to the vest.
You’ll have to find me. But if you do, I’m happy to give you a tour.
[00:52:06] Jeremiah: Okay, sounds good. Um, and I’ll link your YouTube and everything in the, uh, comments or the not comments section. I’m thinking YouTube now, in the description of the show. And, uh, that way people can find it really easy. And, uh, thank you for coming on and speaking with us and talking about ghostly, spooky.
[00:52:27] Victor: Absolutely, Jeremiah, thank you for having me. I also do have a tour guide I just put out about the City of Roswell, New Mexico, so I’ll let you know about that one too.
[00:52:37] Jeremiah: Oh, nice. Yeah, I’ll check that out. I just started watching, uh, I think it was made in 1992, the c b s movie intruders, and a lot of people say it’s like the best movie.
Series on alien abductions. So I believe I watched it back in the day, but it’s so long ago. I don’t remember. So I’m rewatching it now to, to kind of get a glimpse at
[00:53:04] Victor: it. Interesting. Yeah. Uh, I always thought that was fire in the sky, but I’m willing to check out anything. So,
[00:53:10] Jeremiah: yeah, it’s called intruders.
I’ve seen fire in this guy That was good too. Uh mm-hmm. , the Travis Walton case. Yep. And, uh, Travis Wal. He’s kind of an odd dude, but I totally believe his experience. I think he really experienced it and
[00:53:29] Victor: yeah, I, I think so too. There’s a, there’s an even weirder experience and, but it’s another story for another time.
If I can find the link to it, I’ll send it to you. .
[00:53:39] Jeremiah: Yeah, definitely do that. Um, my specialty is like alien abductions, alien phenomenon. I really love researching that and talking about that. So yeah, if you send it to me, I’ll definitely check it out.
[00:53:52] Victor: All right. You got it. Thank you for having me. But
[00:53:54] Jeremiah: yeah, thanks for coming on and have a good rest of your
[00:53:57] Victor: weekend.
Thanks, you too, Jeremiah.