To Hell and Back Kathy McDaniel

To Hell and Back

To Hell and Back Kathy McDaniel

[00:00:00] Jeremiah: Hello!, my fellow, terrestrials coming to you from an RV deep in the Carolina mountains. Welcome to the, what if they’re wrong podcast, the podcast that wants you to question everything, your reality is about to be shared.

before we get into this amazing interview with Kathy and her near death experience. If you could go and rate and review this podcast, if you enjoy. Or even if you don’t enjoy it, just give me a review, a rating. It would help me tremendously with the rankings and getting this podcast out to more people.

Also, if you would like to be a guest or have a topic idea, email me at what, if they’re That’s what if they’re wrong without the and I can work on getting you on the show. So without further ado here is Kathy and her near-death experience. Welcome to the what if they’re wrong podcast.


This is Jeremiah and I am joined today by M K McDaniel. She’s an author of a her near-death experience and we’ll call her Kathy for this. And we are going to talk to her today about her near-death experience and how it’s changed her life and how the experience is shared by many people around the world.

So we’ll introduce her now, Kathy. Hello,

[00:01:58] M.K. McDaniel: Hello to the people and hello to Jeremiah. Thanks for having me on,

[00:02:04] Jeremiah: oh yes. Thank you for coming on. I’m excited about this. Near death experiences and hearing about them. So this’ll definitely be fun for me. So the first thing I want to ask is when you had this experience, what was your mental mind state as far as like religion?

Were you practicing anything or was religion kinda in the back of your mind or I’m just trying to get an idea for. Where your mind state was when this experience happened? Because a lot of people, uh, say that near-death experiences are only for the religious people, but myself, when I had mine, I was an atheist.

So I just like to hear different people’s positions in life when they’re near death happened,

[00:02:57] M.K. McDaniel: um, I was a cradle Catholic as they call it. My dad was an atheist, like. Young man. But he went to world war two and was a fighter pilot. He got shot down, uh, over the Philippines, his plane crash caught fire turned upside down and he was looking at death.

So he said, okay, God, if you’re out there, save me. And if you do on my whole family will become Catholic within seconds. The three guys came out of the jungle, uh, open the cockpit, drug him out and saved him. So we became Catholics and my. We’re an S well, dad died of COVID last year, but mom’s still, uh, a Catholic.

So is my sister and, and most of the family, I was, uh, very much a Catholic. I’ve always struggled with some of the concepts of God and some of the rules and all that. But I, I was taught that, uh, There was heaven, purgatory, and hell. And purgatory was just like, hell, except she got out. And I always went to schools, always with the nuns and, uh, this was drummed into me and I, I believed it.

I believed. I would, when I died, I’d go to purgatory. Cause only saints went straight to heaven and there weren’t many of them. So I would spend time in purgatory, get my sins burned off, and then I could go to heaven and be pure before God. That’s just the way it was. I believed it. So that’s the way my religious, uh, exp I had, you know, I had a lot of trauma in my life.

And so a lot of times I was questioning God, shaking my fist at him, you know, what’s going on? What’s you know, why, why are you doing this to me? So we had kinds of some struggles, but that’s where I was.

[00:04:45] Jeremiah: Okay. And then what were you? So my near-death was when I was just sleeping in bed. Where were you in life when your near death experience happened?

[00:04:57] M.K. McDaniel: I was 53. Um, I had a very dear best friend that came down with leukemia. He was 50. And he needed some caregivers to go with him to Seattle, to go to a research hospital.

They, they didn’t, they couldn’t stop it. And they wanted to try some of this research. You know, they do trials and stuff on people that volunteer. So I went up there being told it would be two or three months and eight months later after a lot of, of, of trauma of him getting better than. And, uh, he died and, you know, he was my best friend and I just couldn’t understand it.

Plus I was exhausted. Uh, it was, it was a day and night situation, a lot of, a lot of stress. So I was visiting some people and I caught this virulent flu that was going around in LA and I brought it back home and I got super sick and, uh, it turned into pneumonia. And then by the time they got me to the ER, um, it was going into ARDS, which is acute respiratory distress syndrome, which is also called lung failure.

So when people die of complications of pneumonia, like with SARS or even COVID, it’s, it’s hard. So they said I had a 38% chance of making it. They, uh, told my family, mom didn’t look good. They uh, said they were gonna have to put me on a drug induced coma. Uh, trached me and, uh, put me on a ventilator and said pray.

So the doctor, just as I was getting ready to go out, uh, said, now don’t worry. You won’t remember anything that goes on. We’re giving you something called white amnesia and it makes it impossible for you to remember anything. Go to sleep and he didn’t add, and hopefully we’ll wake you up one of these days.

Uh, so I had no choice. So, um, my dad gave me a thumbs up, you know, from the, the window in my room and I went away

[00:06:58] Jeremiah: and, uh, I don’t know if I asked this, but how old were you when this happened? You were

[00:07:02] M.K. McDaniel: in your faith? Uh, actually I was 52 and between 52 and 53, it went on for. Okay. And I was in great health, you know, I just sold my business and, um, I was, I was fine

[00:07:16] Jeremiah: real estate.

I think I heard,

[00:07:19] M.K. McDaniel: yeah, I had a real estate property management business, but I was in, had been in the business before that. Um, I loved it. I got to help. A lot of people hired my, my sister and my daughter and, and we just had a great time, but it. I decided I’d been working since I was 18 and I was through with it.

And so I thought I’m just going to take a few years off. So I moved up to Mendocino, um, in, uh, lived in my best friend’s house. And so that’s, that’s where I was when that happened.

[00:07:47] Jeremiah: So the last thing you remember before your near death was the doctors putting you out for this surgery?

[00:07:55] M.K. McDaniel: No, it wasn’t surgery.

They were just to, they back in those days that, you know, it was a 1999. Didn’t know a whole lot about it. They just gave you odds. And then they tried to, there was a secret to putting enough pressure on the ventilator to keep your lungs, uh, inflated, because if they didn’t, they are fills your, your lungs up with this gooey stuff and they’ll stick the.

And you die, but if they put too much pressure and blows a hole in a lung and you die. So this was, uh, they were experimenting back then. And if my daughter hadn’t gotten online and found a, an arts group of survivors and they were, um, really good about giving her numbers and stuff, which she gave to my pulmonologist, which is probably the reason that, that they, they kept me alive longer.

You can’t cure ARDS. Can’t give it a shot. Give it medication. It just, they told me your body decides, is it going to quit making this glue or not? And they just waited out and try and keep your lungs inflated. Um, yeah, it was a, it’s a weird, weird thing.

[00:09:06] Jeremiah: Yeah. The technology for medicine has come a very long way since, uh, back then, for sure.

So what’s the first. Thing that you remember encountering once you went under and started your,

[00:09:23] M.K. McDaniel: I don’t know how long, you know, in that three week period, uh, it took for this to happen, but I just became conscious. Um, I, I woke up, I had no idea where I was, it was pitch black and I couldn’t hear anything. I didn’t know if I was laying down or sitting or I was like, so he put me in a closet and I, I was just stunned. Didn’t know what to do. Just sat there or there, or floated there. Thought I was dead. Just thought it, you know, I wasn’t in Kansas anymore. Um, I, I waited. I thought, well, I, you know, something’s got to happen here. I mean, somebody will come looking for me, but what happened is it started to get a little lighter and I thought, oh, my eyes are getting used to the darkness, you know?

And then it, uh, there was like a reddish glow. And then I thought, oh, well maybe the sun’s coming up. I don’t know. And then it looked like it was kind of foggy and this and blowing around. When you see a, a stage play in there, they’re making, you know, fog and stuff. I thought, what? Then I started hearing these moans and screeches and it got hot and it smelled bad.

Thought this can’t be good. And, I just waited and there’s, this fog was so thick. Next, there’s all of a sudden this, this horrible voice, just boom, you know, like was standing right next to me or something. It just said, do you know where you are all spooky and, and mean, and. It was beyond creepy, you know, I just said, uh, my mind was racing and I thought, well, there’s only one place this could be.

I thought, I hope I’m wrong. Just said, hell. He just went more, uh, this huge, horrible voice, man. Dared me have to, well, I didn’t know I was dead. I just, I just turned from the voice and ran into the black. I didn’t care if I fell on something or what it, you know, that thing was coming for me.

So I just kept running and then it lightened up again. It was the weirdest thing. Um, it was live. It was a bond, but out huge metropolis city, I was in and there were fires and, and big concrete buildings had fallen over and there was big chunks of concrete rebar sticking out of them and people screaming and, uh, wailing.

And again, I just stood there frantic and thought, oh my God. You know, there was an atomic bomb. That’s what happened. Um, you know, I didn’t remember being in the hospital. I didn’t remember anything, but I thought that’s what’s happened and I have to hide. So I did, I tucked in to a behind a concrete thing and, and I can just kind of shaking and looking around thinking, oh my God, oh my God.

I didn’t say God. Got to take that back. Just, I never had the sense of God the entire time I was there. It was like, it was blocked out or something, but I knew I was in trouble. I saw some body, some person, some thing, uh, quite a ways away, kind of ducked down in there. And I thought, well, it could be the.

Whoever the enemy is, or, or somebody like me. So I just shouted out, Hey, you know, I’m over here. Maybe we could get together, you know, I’ll get water, you get a fire started, you know, a girl scout thing kicking in and, and this boys just came back. We are all alone here. Was

[00:13:15] Jeremiah: it the same voice? As

[00:13:18] M.K. McDaniel: you know, this was like a person’s voice, but really depressed, you know?

Yeah, I thought, well, he’s not going to be any help. And so then I heard like this skittering sound and I’m thinking aliens. Right. You know, I mean, it’s like, and then shadows go by great big shadows, like, like huge spiders. And I ate spiders. So I, I mean, it’s terrifying and, and. I thought, well, I’ve just got to get out of here before they come.

They’re gonna eat me. And I just went running, you know, and tried to climb up this thing and they got closer and I just closed my eyes. I thought that’s it. And then I woke up, not woke up. It became light again. And this happened over and over again. I mean, when I got back, people said, well, how long were you there?

Well, I didn’t have a watch. You know? Uh, I, it felt like a couple of years. I mean, there was so many things that happened and they, it just drug on and on. And, uh, but it was like a movie set each time. It was a different place, different beings. Sometimes they were demons. And there’s no other word for it. I mean, if, if you saw one, I mean, that’s what you’d say.

That’s a demon and they’re mean and awful. And they were trying to tell me I was stuck down there forever and I just had to give up and despair. I’d never get. I thought, oh man, I’m not a quitter. And I’m not just going to buy that. This is not a good place where I want to stay. So I thought, well, I’ll play along.

Maybe I’ll find a door someplace or somebody to help me. But it, it was like, again, people ask me, well, why didn’t you do this? Why didn’t you do it? Well, you’re running for your life. You know? I mean, I didn’t have time to release it and, and consider all I would say doing is trying to stay one step ahead of.

Things that were trying to destroy me. And it was very, um, depressing and, uh, uh, again, it just went on and on with all these different scenarios. And the weird thing was that I saw two people that were alive. So this is another thing that made me didn’t even Dawn on me that I was dead. I mean, You know, I was, I felt alive.

Somebody, people, people say, well, did you have feet? What were you wearing? And it’s like, I don’t know. There wasn’t a mirror. I know. You’re just, you, you don’t know your soul is you, whether you’re in a body or out of a body, it’s like being in a car. You’re not the car, it just gets you around. And that’s how the best way I can describe how a soul feels to me in my body.

So, uh, when it got worse and worse, And, uh, the people that I saw there, I saw two and they were both relatives and, um, they wouldn’t help me. They were mean to me and they wouldn’t help me. And I was so confused and I thought, what is wrong with everybody? But when I got back, I, I was really moved and pulled to give them each a message, a message that would make a difference in the way they were living their lives.

And I mean, how do you go up to somebody and say, I saw you now. And if you don’t change your ways, it’s like, oh, okay. They’re thinking she’s lost it. Um, so I did, I gave them the message, one of them for about a month or so, never talked to me again, which was on bad because we were really close and the other one was in a bad situation in her inner real.

She listened to what I said, but she was so wrapped up with what she was dealing with. She didn’t really pay attention, but 10 years later I see her at Christmas, one of our Christmases and she came up and she says, okay, tell me again, what you saw in hell. And I told her and she says, oh my gosh, that just that’s exactly what I was going through at the time.

And she got a divorce from this very. Nice person. And, uh, it, it, what was happening in the scenario that I saw was a metaphor for what was happening in her marriage and her relationship, but she finally had the guts to get out of there. And, uh, she just says, that is just so amazing that, that, that you, you knew that because she didn’t really share what much of what was going on.

So that was, that was a good thing that came out of it. Now, one out of two ain’t bad.

[00:18:01] Jeremiah: The way you described it was that each scene was different. Can you describe some of the other scenes that dead they hadn’t played through? Hang

[00:18:10] M.K. McDaniel: on to your share? Uh, is hell it was never pleasant. Um, I can talk a little lighter about it now because it’s been 22 years, but it’s still like emblazed on my soul.

So almost every night I have to really concentrate to not go there when it’s. You know, it’s, it’s still haunts me. It’s, uh, it’s not pleasant. It is. In fact, when I went to my second or third therapist, she says, I’ve got to put PTSD on your chart. I, you know, you’re just a mess. I said, well, thank you very much.

How much is this going to cost me? Um, but it was, it is it’s real. Um, there was a terrible thing in an abortion clinic. Later on. I’ll explain why I think all these scenarios happened, but on earth I had been a pro-lifer and I had volunteered to help ladies, uh, that had decided to keep their babies and that sort of thing.

So to be, to flash in, like I say, it was just like flashing in and the lights went up and at least I was someplace that I could see. Most of the places were very, very. And spooky that way, but this, this was just like too bright. And I thought the smell and the big, long white hallway and all the lights, I thought I’m in a hospital, eh, that, and I thought, wow, okay, I’m going to find other people.

I’ll find a door out of here, catch a bus, whatever I can get out. But when I, I, I looked at the end of this tunnel and that’s when I saw these great big kind of big foot look and. Sorta close on with, uh, uh, like a truncheon or, uh, something that, that you would electrocute people with or something. And I thought what, you know, I’m looking at that thing and I thought that doesn’t look good.

So I looked at the left and right. And there was a door on either side of me that were just canted open just a little bit. And so I thought, well, I’ll, I’ll run in there, but by the time I looked up to see where he was, he was standing right in front of me. I mean, I had heard thump, thump, thump, thump of heavy feet, but he moved really fast.

So, um, he was looming over me with this big. He says, you’ve got a job. I said, oh yeah. Says, yeah, you’re going to go in that room over there. Uh, you’re going to pick up where they give you and you’re going to tell them across the hall, I’m going to keep an eye on you. And you’re going to put it in that room.

Then you’re going to go back. And this is your job. And I thought, I ha well, Rooms, I can get out of his, you know, out of his line of sight for a while. Maybe I can duck out, you know, so I said, sure. You know, so he pointed with a truncheon or whatever that thing was. Went in and it was a rather large room with, again, lots of lights, but there were like patients on gurneys lined up for rose.

Thought, huh. There were people between. These were obviously women, they were laying on their back. Their legs were splayed. There were sheets around their legs. Were people on like little stools in front of them with utensils doing, working there’s blood everywhere. And, I thought, oh, I don’t like the looks of this at all.

One of the doctors just raised his hand. His glove was all bloody and he’s waving his hand and I’m standing there and he turns around and barks at me. He says, get all our hair, you know, don’t make me. So I’m, I’m in shock. I walk over and I’m afraid of what I’m going to see. Looked down and he says here, and he, and he has the remains of this poor little, tiny body and all the blood and everything.

He says, stick out your arms. And, I did because I was in shock and he just slapped it in my arms and said, no, take, go. So I’m, I’m, I’m in shock. I turned around, I walk out into the hall, I stare at this demon and he’s pointing to the other. So I went to the other room and walked in. And as far as I could see in this great big, huge room was just piles of these little bodies and the stench was terrible and gagged.

And I thought, oh, this is, this is hell. You know, but I didn’t know that’s where I was, but I thought, how could this even exist? So I went over and laid this little body down and I went back in the hall and he pointed back into the operating room and I said, no, I’m not going to do that. He says, this is your job and you’re going to do it.

And if you don’t, you have no idea what you’re going to have. What’s going to happen to you next. And I just crossed my arms and I said, I’m not going to do it. So I just closed my, he lifted that thing up, like he was going to hit me. So I just closed my eyes. I don’t know. I don’t care. And boom, I found myself at another place and that just went on and on.

Uh, between some of those scenarios, I found myself like on this road, uh, it was just rocks and dirt, but it looked like it had been tried before. So I didn’t know which direction to go. I just went one way. And then I went the other way and I turned to the right and got on the road, just started walking and it was just like dusk and I, there was no stars and no sun or moon or anything.

Low hanging, um, clouds and maybe in the, there’d be a pile of rocks or, uh, you know, nothing to look at, but I, I thought I’d at least I’m alone. You know, at least maybe this road will lead somewhere. So I spent a lot of time on that road, just walking and walking and walking and looking behind me to make sure something wasn’t sneaking up on me and, and afraid to fail.

Other people, but hoping I’d find somebody or a way out. So it, I remember there’s no sense of humor and hell test. That’s just how I cope with stuff. At one point when I was walking and walking into the scene where he didn’t even seem to change, I just half as joked to myself, maybe I’m really on a big trip.

I’m just going to be really thin at the end of this experience, but, uh, in it, then it would just kind of veer off. That’s when I had seen one of the relatives that, uh, later on thanked me, um,

[00:24:39] Jeremiah: she, I was going to ask, um, how you came across the people that were still alive in life, in the, this experience.

Like how

[00:24:50] M.K. McDaniel: well her hers was about, about halfway through. I didn’t know how long this thing was going to go on, but about halfway through, I was walking on this road and I just remember thinking I’m thirsty, I’m tired, I’m hungry now. And again, people say, well, you are a urine, Hal, you didn’t know you didn’t have a body.

And it’s like, I don’t care. My mice. I didn’t know I was dad. And that’s how I felt. And, um, it’s like, And again, when, when I was hurt by people, how did you feel it? Um, if you believe that something’s going to hurt you, you’ll you’ll feel that pain just before it hits, you know, uh, like if somebody starts to punch you in the nose, but they pull the punch and they stopped just a half an inch, shorter your nose, you’ll always go, you know, like you’ve been hit even though you haven’t.

I that’s how I, I, I, I sensed it I guess. And it was so real that I felt it. So anyway, I, I, all of a sudden started smelling. Something good. And I thought, oh my gosh, this house, it smells like food. Oh, well that may be civilization. Maybe things are looking up. Maybe I’m getting in a better spot. I get a blah, blah, blah, blah.

So I, I hurried down there and it was weird. There was a guy sitting in a chair on one side and he was dressed kind of funny, but he was grumpy looking and, and staring at this person on the other side. So I looked on the other side and there was my F my. She was dressed strangely and then she had, she was a really good cook, really good cook.

And she’s got tables. Like she’s preparing a banquet for a hundred people. She was always throwing great big parties. And, um, and oh, I always thought, oh, I was thrilled. I just said, hi, you know? And, uh, she just looked like she was busy and she looked up kind of annoyed. Oh, I can see you’re really busy, but, you know, can you just spare just a little plate of anything?

I am starving and just a little glass of water. And she, and I always were very, very close and she’s younger. And, uh, she says this, this is for important people. I mean, I was just dismissed and I was hurt and I was shocked and I thought, wow. And so she turned her back on me and, you know, I felt terrible, but I kept going.

So that was one of them. Uh, the other was coming upon this movie set, that was a beauty parlor, you know, uh, and it was supposed to be like, I guess, Twilight zone or something, because the stage was kind of funny. And the chairs were angled and the mirrors were all screwy looking. And, uh, she was a person that always looked her best.

She always, she was very professional, very, um, oh, she just was amazing that way. But, uh, my sense was that she probably could have used a little more interior beauty because there was a lot of, um, Um, criticism of other people who didn’t look good all the time. She was always after me, me, but to wear something more fashionable or, you know, do something with your hair.

So anyway, there she is. And, uh, I just looked at this beauty parlor and I thought, Hmm, I saw two of her friends standing there too. They were friends from high school. I didn’t know them very well, but they were. And, uh, so I just looked at her and she says, oh my God, it looked like hell. And I thought, I, you know, going through and you’re worried about how I look, you know?

So she says, get up in this chair, we need your dog, God makeup, uh, you divorce your hair, that kind of nonsense, you know? And I says, no, you’ve got to listen to me. You’ve got to listen to me. This is serious. This is a serious thing. It doesn’t matter how. And she, and they all started laughing at me, laughing mean laughing and, and wouldn’t stop.

And so I, I got off the stage, got back on the road, you know, so that was the other person. Um, but there were a lot of, there were, uh, uh, zombie people. Uh, that’s all I can say about them. There was another demon that monitored. Cut down an entire black buried field. I don’t know if you’ve ever seen Blackberry canes or anything like that.

He told me shortly after I got there, but they’re big and thick. They’re about an inch and a half thick with big spines on them. That when they grow, they overlap each other and they’d just take over. They’re all over Washington where I live. Shortly after I got there, he says, you want to get out of here?

I says, well, yeah. He says, well, I’ll see to it that you get out of here. If you’ll just do one thing. And I say he was a big demon, you know? And so I’m talking to this demon, but I’m playing along. Cause he said the magic words get out of here. And um, I says, okay. So he says, all you have to do. And it was like, somebody lifted a curtain.

And as far as you could see where all these Blackberry vines and he says, all you got to do is cut those down and you can get out of here. Well, back on earth, I had had several houses that I moved into that had these lines and I know you need great. Huge Clippers. You have to cut them in a six inch pieces and put them in plastic bags and you’ve got to wear gloves and heavy duty clothes because those things will eat you.

So, there I am just me, no gloves, no nothing, any, he hands me this pair of kidney garden scissors that they use for cutting paper and it starts laughing. laughing. And, I thought. Sure work, you know, and he’s laughing and he said, you want to get out, you know? And so I said, give me those. So I took the scissors.

When in Rome, you got to do what they’d rooms they’re doing. So I leaned down, I’m getting all scratched up and I’m starting to Nall away at one of these canes. I mean, now my fingers are starting to cramp and I finally. I’m surrounded now by all these vines. So, I pick it up and I’m going to put it somewhere, but there’s so many around me.

It’s hard to put it down, but I did. I forced it back and I sat it down. I turned, just cut another one. And the thing grew back. So now this demons think, oh, I’ve made his day. He is really laughing mean and stuff. And I just thought he’s. Just give up. You’re not getting out of here. Despair. Everyone does.

Yeah, it’ll be fine. And I said, no. So I leaned down and start cutting again. And that’s when boom, whenever I would, you know, bulk they’d send me someplace worse. Um, yeah, so it, it went on and on and got worse and worse. And then at the very end and I didn’t know what was going to be the. I was, I had traveled through a very long distance and very high snow up about our chest Heights with some other beaten and attacked women like myself, um, to go to this cabin in the middle of freaking nowhere and cold as hell is a real thing.

Um, and we were waiting for our customers, which did not sound promising. Yeah, and hell I can imagine. Uh, so I, we were all a little in the dumps and, um, I, the demon lady that was with us, um, was there and I said, you know, I’ve been here a long time and it seems particularly depressing. Is there something I don’t know, she says, well, it’s Christmas on earth and it’s always the worst day.

That’s the first I heard of hell, you know, and I thought I’m in hell. You know, I, you know, I still thought I was alive and, um, I don’t know, something in me was just worn out. So there’s so I started,

[00:33:13] Jeremiah: sorry, there was a, so from your experience, there was male and female demons in, well, we know this

[00:33:22] M.K. McDaniel: well, um, I think, so this woman was like a half a demon.

I don’t know if you evolve or if you’re, I don’t know the, how it was, but you could tell it was a woman. Um, and it’s funny because she seemed to me when I got back, I thought she, she reminded me of somebody and she reminded me of an actress. I can’t remember her name, but was an actress that I Al she always played a really mean part sometimes.

Remember that I always had to turn it off the television whenever she came on, she just gave me such an awful feeling, awful feeling. Didn’t understand then, but that’s who that was. Uh, and again, I’ll tell you about how you make your own health. Um, when I was started to sing the song, it was my favorite, uh, um, Christmas Carol.

I just started singing away in a MI. She started shrieking and told me to shut up. A couple of the other ladies started joining me, you know, so away in a manger, no crib for his bed. She’s, she’s, there’s a bunch of us all packed in this room. So she’s breaking through the crowd coming at me with her stick and it comes to the little Lord and she shrieks so loud and I closed my eyes and that.

You wanted me to kind of pause here? Oh

[00:34:53] Jeremiah: no. We’ll continue with your story. I’ll ask at the end because I think it’ll encompass everything.

[00:35:00] M.K. McDaniel: Okay. So again, boom, light, but it’s different. Light is warm. Is loving. You know, it’s just incredible love and joy. And. Piece. And I completely forgot everything that came before all.

I was just totally immersed in this wonderful love. I was, I was just shocked and in awe and, and so happy. It was a, it was like a big room, but it was all white with this light and just kind of had, I dunno, denser or things that made it feel like a room and, and, um, I looked around and there was my friend who had died the month before I did.

You know, had had leukemia last time I saw him, his hair, it all fallen out. He was all purple and swollen and stuff. And he looked wonderful. He looked 35 years old. He was healthy and, and, and laughing. And, uh, he was wearing a sweater I’d given him. And I, I couldn’t believe it. Oh, my gosh, he doesn’t know he’s dead, still thinking I was alive and he just starts laughing and I thought, wait a minute, I didn’t say that out loud.

He read my mind. And then I thought he still has got that look like, I know something you don’t know. And I says, oh my gosh, I’m dead. I’m so excited. So tired. In heaven. And this is just fabulous. I’m so, you know, so I, I, I’m saying to my. Come on. Let’s go show me. Let’s go see. And then he just kind of stopped.

And I looked around and I, I remember there was a big table. I got an architect’s table with this huge book and it’s open about halfway and I thought, wait a minute. He was showing me something in that book. What was. And I thought, well, I don’t remember what it was, but I know I said, oh no, that’s going to be too hard.

I want to stay here with you. And he just said, now, Mary Kay, that’s what he always call me. You’ve got too much left to do. I thought, oh crap, they’re throwing me out. You know? No. I said, no, absolutely not. No, it works in hell. Huh?

Do you

[00:37:36] Jeremiah: think the, a book that you saw was like the book of life, you know, how you always hear about that?

[00:37:43] M.K. McDaniel: I think it was my life and it was only halfway open 50, you know, and I, you know, and I’m thinking, oh my gosh, I’m going to be in like nineties or something. I, you know, was just flashing through my mind.

And I thought, no, it was edited. It just irks you when you get back and, and, you know, they told you what you were going to be doing and, and they, they don’t let you remember it just, you know, I guess that’s cheating if you remember, you know, and then you’d go straight to it and get it done. But, um, uh, I found myself and I think it was kind of a timeout room.

Some people have one you’re so mad when they send you. Uh, most people, very few people choose to go back and less. The only ones I hear about it is the ones that just have had a baby. They died giving birth and they just cannot leave that child. And they’re allowed to go back for that or if they’ve got small children.

Um, but I was, um, I was like in a timeout place. It was like this beautiful. No Glenn, one of the flowers and the stuff, and it was calm. There was a stream, you know, and I walked down the stream down the street and Jimmy back, you know, I ran into three people there who gave me gifts and told me I had to give them to this person that I knew.

And, and it was just kind of weird, but I, I was kind of resigned. I was, I always had forgotten the heavens stuff. I’m just. Figuring out how I got here. Uh, but I’d forgotten that. And so I, I woke up and there’s a bright, light, right. Light in the CCU waiting for me and all these people that I’m thinking. I think I know those people.

Where am I? And what’s going on is hot again. Um, I can’t move. I can’t talk. Am I back in hell? And then. It was, it was awful. Uh, you know, that the people turned around and one of them says, oh, mom’s back. They’re running over. My daughter and my mom, and everybody’s happened and praising God, and I’m thinking, oh, crap, how horrible what happened?

It dawns on me. I thought I’ve got too much left to do, and I can’t move. I can’t. What kind of crummy joke is this? You know, I mean, I was one, it was really good that I couldn’t talk for awhile several days, several days for it to them and to put some sort of a device in my throat so I could talk like a robot, but at least I could talk, but I was so filled within gratitude that, um, I probably would have been rude.

So it was good that I had a chance to settle down and dig in and they had to keep telling me what was going on. Uh, of the drugs coming out of the drugs and I still remembered hell it came back and I thought, oh my God, I’m, I’m going to have to die again. I’m going to have to go to purgatory again and do this again.

How was not a happy camper? Um, so, um, it took a while for me to understand. Going on. I couldn’t move because I had lost, I had weighed like 105 going in and now I weighed 86. I had no muscle mass, so I couldn’t move. And, um, I could blink and move one finger. That was it, my left hand. And I’m right-handed, you know, it doesn’t get any better.

Um, and I was told that, uh, they were going to keep me another week and the critical care. And, um, I’d been there three almost. And then they were going to try and get me to a physical rehab facility. I had to fight with the insurance. They thought I was a lost cause why? She said that, why should we waste money on you?

You can’t even move. I said, listen, sister, you have no idea what I have been through and what I can do. Um, I’ve had my own business. I’m, you know, blah-blah-blah you better? You better give me a chance or, um, I’ll track you down. So she, they said, okay, we’ll give you a. A week at a time, and we were able to set high goals.

And at the end of that week, all your doctors have to get together with a meeting and assure us that you have met every single one of these goals every week, or we’re pulling the plug. You know, you can go to a convalescent hospital and die basically. Um, so I was motivated and, um, I did what they said and it was hard.

It was hard. And the pressing and I was angry and I probably the anger. Get me get me going. But, uh, my family stayed for several weeks and then they left and then I felt so all alone. And, uh, the fellow I had been dating, um, had been to the hospital every day. I had only known him about three months, three, four months.

And, um, uh, he asked me to marry him and, uh, I said, sure. I you’re a sport. Tell ya, you know, and he says, I believe in you, I, I know who you are be under all of that, you know, medical gear. Um, it’ll be fine. And so, um, I, he took me to, we’ve got a house and, and, um, we got married and we were together 11 years and.

Uh, about eight years, nine years, nine years into the marriage, it was, it was coming unglued. Um, you know, I mean, it’s amazing. We made it that far, but, um, he, uh, had a problem with prostate numbers that were coming out bad and he didn’t want to go on and get the test because it was painful and I made him go.

When they got the results, uh, seven of the 10 tests showed aggressive. The doctor said that if they hadn’t found it, he would have been dead in two years. That was. 15 years ago, 20 years ago, you still here. So I, we each saved each other’s lives, you know, I believe now that we plan our own lives and all, we bring all our, our, our soulmates with us.

And, um, and so he and I agreed to meet up when it was going to be tough for either one of us. And so we’re still really good friends. Um, yeah, everything changed after I got back everything I, I believed in and thought. And, uh, it took me 10 years to get two ions, which is the international association of near-death studies where there’s thousands of formerly dead people, my tribe.


[00:44:39] Jeremiah: I actually didn’t know about that. So I’m going to have to do look that,

[00:44:43] M.K. McDaniel: oh yeah, anytime you’ve got an NDE ear, it’s fabulous. And it’s not just Andy’s his STEs and, you know, spiritually transformative events or, or when you have lucid dreams or anything in the, in the spiritual realm. There’s thousands and thousands.

And it’s not just everyday people like me. There’s neuroscience, scientists, and lawyers and doctors. And if you know it, it’s, it’s been proven, you know, that these things are real and the majority of people come back spiritual rather than religious. And so it, it, it took me a long time to trans well, it’s called, uh, deconstructing now, uh, To, to move into a comfortable place of being spiritual and to ease out of my religion, which didn’t throw.

Family, the bad thing too about coming back is people don’t want to believe what happened to you is particularly if you’ve been to hell. I mean, you know, it reflects on them somehow. How did I fail her? What was she up to that we didn’t know about? Um, that sort of thing. And they don’t want to talk about it.

They don’t want to talk about it. So you kind of feel very lost and alone. So now I’ve got this thing about the COVID people, all those people in ventilators, I’m thinking, oh, how many of those had that experience? How many of them are coming out of this? And nobody wants to talk to them about it. So I’m not shouting out anybody, uh, get ahold of me on my website or, um, that’s www dot misfit in hell to heaven.

Ex-pat dot com. That’s the name of the. But I’m also, I on irons, they have sharing groups, you know, different, uh, topics and stuff. Anybody can join and I’ve just started a distressing and the sharing group for people who want to know more about those types or have had them themselves, and they can come and talk with people like themselves.

So there’s a lot of resources out there that I didn’t know about. And it was another 10 years after finding ions. Badgering to me to write a book because only about oh 12 to 20% of people have anything distressing or disturbing in an ND. Most of them, you know, I was the angels and the flowers and the butterflies and all that’s lucky stuff.

Um, but uh, they said you’ve got to write a book because there’s only three or four of them out there right now. And people need to know they’re not alone. So a year and a half ago, I finally wrote my book. Got it published. And, and, um, and it sound. And that’s misfit in hell because I was a misfit. I can’t packing up and then have an ex-pat.

And that’s because I believe we’re all pieces of God. Our souls are pieces of God’s soul and we start off in heaven and we come down to earth and we do our work and then we go home just like a next Patriot. So that’s

[00:47:35] Jeremiah: the, so one last thing before we wrap it up, you mentioned something about how you believe that you can create your own.

Um, I don’t know if you can speak on that real quickly.

[00:47:47] M.K. McDaniel: Yeah, real quickly. I was born, raised and believed what they told me about having to go to purgatory hell. So I believe that I manifested that I believed I was going to go, I live my life as if it was going to happen. I made decisions knowing that was going to happen.

And so I made my own hell. I learned in heaven that God is all for. And all loving and would never condemn anybody. You go to hell because you think you’re going to go, or you choose to, there are people that don’t want to be around God, but nobody has to go to hell. Most people just wake up and bliss.

[00:48:28] Jeremiah: Yeah. I’ve heard that as well. Like in a lot of the near-death experience, uh, people who have been to hell, um, it’s only been. Well, it doesn’t feel like a short time when you’re there, but it was like, you weren’t permanently there. You, a lot of them end up going to heavenly place afterwards, kinda like showing, you know, uh, both sides of the coin, I guess.

[00:48:57] M.K. McDaniel: So the other thing I’ve learned over that is, uh, I asked for something positive to be able to remind myself instead of just the negative. So every day I say this, this mantra, God helped me to be loving kind, merciful, forgiving, encouraging, grateful non-judgemental and useful. That’s an answer to my prayer when I asked God, what can I do?

That’s positive. So, um, anyway, I hope that

[00:49:26] Jeremiah: helps. Yeah, that was good. Um, so is there any thing else you’d like to share with my audience and I’ll make sure. Put your links for your book and everything in the show notes and all the, I don’t know if you have any parting words.

[00:49:42] M.K. McDaniel: Well, yeah, the book is, is a memoir.

So it’s about my relatives. Great to great grandparents all the way through to now to kind of explain how we are just kind of a chain from our relatives to us and how we come, the people we are and what, and how we believe in. And it’s all important to look at, not just your own life, but go backwards and forwards.

And, uh, so the book is about that, but it also has the hell experience and what I’ve learned from it, I would say to people, you know, believe in the end in just the goodness of God and, um, you don’t have to belong to a religion of any sort, uh, is just you and God.

[00:50:30] Jeremiah: Yes. I, uh, totally feel like that now. And I think also too, like you said, don’t focus on the negative so much focus on more of the positive.

Um, now we’re all human, we’re all gonna make mistakes. And we’re all gonna have times where we like, oh, that’s, you know, nothing’s going on my way, but in the bigger picture, That’s one thing I’ve learned since my NDE was to look at the bigger picture, more often, just the right in front of your face. And then it seems to ease a lot of the turmoil that you feel

[00:51:12] M.K. McDaniel: well, you know, knowing that I chose my life, I don’t feel like a victim in the world anymore.

I don’t shake my fist at God. Just say, wow, I plan that. Wonder what lesson I wanted to do. Um, it makes, makes that part of your life a whole lot easier too.

[00:51:29] Jeremiah: Yeah, I do feel like life is a bunch of lessons and you can choose how you want to respond to those lessons. Um, so it’s up to you. If a situation is put in front of you, you can choose to do one thing or the other, um, that’s like, what do they say?

A free will free will, but yeah. Certain situations are going to be there regardless of what you do, because it’s part of your learning and growth and all that. I agree. And that’s what I’ve come to experience, but all right, we will wrap it up now. Thank you for coming on and speaking about your

[00:52:11] M.K. McDaniel: experience.

Good luck.

[00:52:13] Jeremiah: Yes, that’s good luck to you too.